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Old 23rd May 2013, 18:49   #17281  |  Link
jdobbs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winenut View Post
It was done as a test...because it's faster to encode a BD5. And as you can see, all the tools are up to date and I was using 44.06.

In any case, switching back to 44.03, I had no problem. Encoded just fine. So it's not the disk.

Busy at work, so further testing and research will have to wait for the weekend. But I thought of something last night and I post this as soon as I do it. But I figure I'll save the LAST.CMD from the good encode and compare it with the LAST.CMD from the bad encode...to see if there a difference...as I'm expecting there will be.

Steve
Try moving the x264.exe from 44.03 to 44.06 and see if it completes.

Have you tried it with the latest release (v0.44.09)? There is a newer version of X264 in that one -- and there were a lot of fixes made in the last three minor releases.
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Last edited by jdobbs; 23rd May 2013 at 19:00.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 21:58   #17282  |  Link
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Jdobbs, i do not usually use an alternative mode in mkv(MKV Container, 1920x1080p, 640Kbps DD5.1) but the second time(below) I get no subtitles, maybe I'm missing something.
Can check?

Code:
LABEL=MISTERIOS_DO_NILO
VERSION=v0.44.09 (beta)
SOURCE_SIZE=11256176640
SOURCE_VIDEO_SIZE=11256176640
TARGET_SIZE=4686086144
REDUCTION=.41631242062669
RESIZE_1080=0
RESIZE_1440=0
AUDIO_TO_KEEP=eng;
KEEP_HD_AUDIO=-1
SUBS_TO_KEEP=por;
BACKUP_MODE=1
MOVIEONLY_TYPE=10
USE_LAVF=0
INSTANCES=2
DGDECNV=-1
QUICK=0
ENCODE_STEP=0
COMPLETED=1
REBUILD_COMPLETE=1
[00000]
AUDIO=100
PGS=1
APULLDOWN=0
S1440=0
VIDEO2=0
V2MBRATE=0
M2TS_TARGET=4686086144
SPLITS=2
NSIZE=0
FLINK=0
MLINK=0
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Old 23rd May 2013, 22:38   #17283  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soneca View Post
Jdobbs, i do not usually use an alternative mode in mkv(MKV Container, 1920x1080p, 640Kbps DD5.1) but the second time(below) I get no subtitles, maybe I'm missing something.
Writing SUPs to MKV is not the default (although it will be on the next release). So, if you created the MKV with BD-RB it would not (by default) include the subtitles.

Look in HIDDENOPTS.TXT -- and add this hidden option:

MKV_MUXSUPS=1

If the subtitles exist in the MKV, BDRB will import them automatically.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 23:16   #17284  |  Link
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Code:
Writing SUPs to MKV is not the default (although it will be on the next release).
Thanks!
Rarely use this option so I had not paid attention to the hidden option...
Glad that option is no longer hidden in the next version!
Code:
If the subtitles exist in the MKV, BDRB will import them automatically.
I've been doing some tests with mkv(sup embedded), and it has worked very well!!!
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Old 23rd May 2013, 23:19   #17285  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soneca View Post
I've been doing some tests with mkv(sup embedded), and it has worked very well!!!
So have I. And it is good. Oddly, I swear I've outputted MKV with Sups embedded, without forcing any setting :S I could be mistaken.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 23:36   #17286  |  Link
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May have activated configuration and forgotten that.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 23:57   #17287  |  Link
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Nope, it's not activated. I probably am mistaken about it outputting with SUP. I greatly look forward to the auto embed feature. But the hidden option could due for now

90% of the time (Lately), I output to AVCHD BD-9 movie only. The 'Great' movies though, I backup to BD-25.
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Old 24th May 2013, 07:00   #17288  |  Link
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I've been testing the Alternate Output (MKV) pretty extensively with AC3 because of recent events.. Thus far, I'm very pleased. Most of my Blu-ray originals I've used the 25GB Backup with. For when Friends and Family come over. Massive thumbs Up to Digistor for their quality BD25 disks (or Euro...disc), too! However, (Huuuuge) thanks to JDobbs and recent events, I've been able to make backups for my TV and LG player via USB. My originals are even now ..more... closely protected than before...as well as "Here, connect this Hard Drive.." I'll never replace the portable HDD, for my disks (discs), and thanks to the JDobbs, BD-RB fits many desires. Everyone should donate...it's Brilliant software by a passionate programmer!

Another note, once I moved OUTPUT_FOLDER from being after [Paths] in the config............Whooo!! Very nice option. I haven't really tried it until tonight. Good speed difference to a completely different partition as I knew!!


JDobbs... Watch "Paul" (or don't)..No Matter --> Thanks............Man!!
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Last edited by AmigaFuture; 24th May 2013 at 07:12.
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Old 24th May 2013, 07:25   #17289  |  Link
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Mmmm, I have some digistor BD-25 discs. They seem agreeable.
It's a CMCMAG-BA5 dye.
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Old 24th May 2013, 08:03   #17290  |  Link
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A few days back I did a batch queue of 3 blu-rays to BD25 format (I use custom size: 24000 for that), it turned out that the first blu-ray was perfect in size like usual, but the 2 other blu-rays turned out to be about 25.500.00.000 in size, about a GB larger than I indicated. After changing the output setting to the default BD25 mode, this problem still occurred, the size didn't even change. I checked the .inf files for the settings and it looks just like previous BD25 back-ups I did. This problem occurred with version 0.44.04 as well as 0.44.09.

The source blu-ray was a stripped criterion blu-ray with only two 400MB menu files and 1 video .m2ts of about 33GB. The output size is always between 24.000.000.000 and 24.500.000.000 just like I want it to be. The output size in this case was 25,556,638,909 bytes.

Code:
[Status]
LABEL=
VERSION=v0.44.09 (beta)
SOURCE_SIZE=36859881741
SOURCE_VIDEO_SIZE=36016257024
TARGET_SIZE=25165824000
REDUCTION=.675311686797229
RESIZE_1080=0
RESIZE_1440=0
AUDIO_TO_KEEP=eng;
KEEP_HD_AUDIO=-1
SUBS_TO_KEEP=all
BACKUP_MODE=0
MOVIEONLY_TYPE=0
USE_LAVF=-1
INSTANCES=1
DGDECNV=0
QUICK=0
ENCODE_STEP=0
COMPLETED=1
REBUILD_COMPLETE=1
[00274]
AUDIO=1
PGS=1
APULLDOWN=0
S1440=0
VIDEO2=0
V2MBRATE=0
M2TS_TARGET=24322199283
RATE=22904
SPLITS=1
NSTART=27000000
NEND=362947275
NSIZE=24713017344
FLINK=0
MLINK=0
Code:
[05/23/13] BD Rebuilder v0.44.09 (beta)
[10:32:28] Source:  
  - Input BD size: 34.33 GB
  - Approximate total content: [02:07:52.289]
  - Target BD size: 23.44 GB
  - Windows Version: 5.1 [2600]
  - Quality: Highest (Very Slow), Two Pass
  - Decoding/Frame serving: X264/LAVF
  - Audio Settings: AC3=0 DTS=0 HD=1 Kbs=640
[10:32:28] PHASE ONE, Encoding
 - [10:32:28] Processing: VID_00274 (1 of 1)
 - [10:32:28] Extracting A/V streams [VID_00274]
 - [10:49:31] Reencoding video [VID_00274]
   - Source Video: MPEG-4 (AVC), 1920x1080
   - Rate/Length: 23.976fps, 178,993 frames
   - Bitrate: 22,904 Kbs
 - [10:49:32] Reencoding: VID_00274, Pass 1 of 2
 - [12:45:40] Reencoding: VID_00274, Pass 2 of 2
 - [21:15:04] Video Encode complete
 - [21:15:06] Processing audio tracks
   - Track 4352 (eng): Keeping original audio
 - [21:15:06] Multiplexing M2TS
[21:23:13]PHASE ONE complete
[21:23:13]PHASE TWO - Rebuild Started
 - [21:23:13] Rebuilding BD file Structure
[21:23:26] - Encode and Rebuild complete
 - WORKFILES folder removed.
[21:23:27] JOB:  finished.
This was the result:



My settings:



I use the LAVF decoding method because that is apparently the only one that works on Linux.

Config file:

Code:
[Options]
VERSION=0.44.0.9
MODE=0
ENCODE_QUALITY=3
ONEPASS_ENCODING=0
AUTO_QUALITY=0
AUDIO_TO_KEEP=eng;
SUBS_TO_KEEP=all
SD_CONVERT=0
OPEN_GOP=0
RESIZE_1080=0
RESIZE_1440=0
DEINTERLACE=1
SD_TO_1080=0
CONVERT_WIDE=0
DTS_REENCODE=0
AC3_REENCODE=0
AC3_640=1
AC3_192=0
KEEP_HD_AUDIO=1
AVCHD=1
REMOVE_WORKFILES=1
MOVIE_ONLY_LOOP=1
REMOVE_OUTPUT=0
USE_FILTERS=0
BDMV_CERT_ONLY=0
USE_LAVF=1
IVTC_PULLDOWN=0
ASSUME_DVD_PAL=0
UNMASK_CHAPTER=0
COMPLETION_BEEP=0
DGDECNV=0
OUTPUT_3D=0
AUDIO_TRACK_LIMIT=0
SUBTITLE_TRACK_LIMIT=0
CUSTOM_TARGET_SIZE=24000
TARGET_SIZE=24000
[Paths]
SOURCE_PATH=Y:\
WORKING_PATH=Y:\WORKING\
.inf file of a previous backup that did succeed:

Code:
[Status]
LABEL=AMELIE
VERSION=v0.43.04 (beta)
SOURCE_SIZE=37716099931
SOURCE_VIDEO_SIZE=37246629888
TARGET_SIZE=25165824000
REDUCTION=.663049355908482
RESIZE_1080=0
AUDIO_TO_KEEP=eng;
KEEP_HD_AUDIO=-1
SUBS_TO_KEEP=all
BACKUP_MODE=0
MOVIEONLY_TYPE=0
USE_LAVF=-1
INSTANCES=1
DGDECNV=0
QUICK=0
ENCODE_STEP=0
COMPLETED=1
REBUILD_COMPLETE=1
[00800]
AUDIO=11
PGS=111
APULLDOWN=0
VIDEO2=0
V2MBRATE=0
M2TS_TARGET=24696353957
RATE=21074
SPLITS=1
NSTART=27000000
NEND=356496480
NSIZE=23924809728
FLINK=0
MLINK=0

Last edited by Yannes; 24th May 2013 at 08:10.
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Old 24th May 2013, 13:18   #17291  |  Link
jdobbs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yannes
A few days back I did a batch queue of 3 blu-rays to BD25 format (I use custom size: 24000 for that), it turned out that the first blu-ray was perfect in size like usual, but the 2 other blu-rays turned out to be about 25.500.00.000 in size, about a GB larger than I indicated. After changing the output setting to the default BD25 mode, this problem still occurred, the size didn't even change. I checked the .inf files for the settings and it looks just like previous BD25 back-ups I did. This problem occurred with version 0.44.04 as well as 0.44.09.
That setting is measured in megabytes. One megabyte is 1048576 bytes. 24000 * 1048576 = 25,165,824,000. The 1% difference is simply rounding due to encoding and muxing accuracy.

What can I say? If you tell BD-RB to output to a size that won't fit on a BD -- you'll get a size that won't fit on a BD. I'd suggest you use the default BD-25 setting.
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Last edited by jdobbs; 24th May 2013 at 15:11.
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Old 24th May 2013, 16:15   #17292  |  Link
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Quote:
(I use custom size: 24000 for that), it turned out that the first blu-ray was perfect in size like usual, but the 2 other blu-rays turned out to be about 25.500.00.000 in size
24000 MB will certainly fit within the capacity of a 25GB BD-R. The problem is that true final size won't be known until the encode has been completed. The bit-size of each frame of film will vary depending upon the content, and BD-RB cannot predict that with 100% accuracy ahead of time. So your 24000 setting is just a target, and BD-RB tries to hit it as best it can.

If you do as JDobbs suggests, and use the default setting (23500 MB), then there will be a little more elbow room for an undersized estimate to still fit on a BD-25 disc.

I use a custom setting of 24200 MB and this almost always gives a burn size of 98% according to ImgBurn. I always use good quality media, so that edge problems (burning close to the max capacity of the disc) should be minimized. I've never detected a problem. I do occasionally get an over-sized rebuild, of course, but probably less than 10% of the time. I just reduce the target and run the process again for that title.

Hope this helps.
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Old 24th May 2013, 17:06   #17293  |  Link
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Originally Posted by RobertM View Post
I always use good quality media, so that edge problems (burning close to the max capacity of the disc) should be minimized. I've never detected a problem.
Maybe not a problem right away from the initial burn/verify, but after playing the disc a few times, in and out of the disc tray and case, touching with our fingers, etc... makes the disc more susceptible to premature failure.
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Old 24th May 2013, 18:09   #17294  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Capsbackup View Post
Maybe not a problem right away from the initial burn/verify, but after playing the disc a few times, in and out of the disc tray and case, touching with our fingers, etc... makes the disc more susceptible to premature failure.
Agreed. I would never trust the outer edges -- even on the most expensive high-quality disc. Is it really worth losing your valuable data to get that last 1% of the disc (which will not noticably affect quality)?
Quote:
24000 MB will certainly fit within the capacity of a 25GB BD-R
If it fits it is pure luck because of undersizing. A BD+R will hold 25,025,314,816 bytes. So I would never recommend a setting of 24000 - as if it sized perfectly it would be 25,165,824,000 and would not fit.
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Old 24th May 2013, 18:22   #17295  |  Link
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I've had Taiyo Yuden discs age at the outer edge. Thankfully, the credits ended up at the edge of the disc I don't even mind undersizing by 1Gb. The difference is negligible, in my opinion. Though I have ran into a few discs, where some material could benefit from that 1Gb, if prioritizing bitrate were possible. Not really hinting here, just an observation.

Though one defect, can compromise a complete backup I no longer use those Disc booklets. Notorious for scratching discs over time. I prefer envelopes, and hard drive backups now.
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Old 24th May 2013, 19:42   #17296  |  Link
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Quote:
If it fits it is pure luck because of undersizing. A BD+R will hold 25,025,314,816 bytes. So I would never recommend a setting of 24000 - as if it sized perfectly it would be 25,165,824,000 and would not fit.
I can't argue with your math: it's spot on.

But...

BD-RB under-sizes my re-encodes all the time. With the default settings I was regularly getting disc image sizes of 94% to 96% (and one 92% IIRC), which I thought was a bit small. Since I switched to 24200 MB (23.63 GB) I regularly get 98%. In fact, for the last 10 rebuilds which required re-encoding none were oversized and none were over 98.5%. Here's the list:

Code:
Image size  	Disc fill %
24,633,278,464	98.4%
24,632,688,640	98.4%
24,549,098,440	98.1%
24,640,028,672	98.5%
24,624,824,320	98.4%
24,629,018,624	98.4%
24,472,190,976	97.8%
24,626,135,040	98.4%
24,639,075,496	98.5%
24,603,376,672	98.3%

By way of comparison, I ran a couple of encodes recently after d/l the latest version of BD-RB, and I forgot to set my custom size, so the target was the default of 22.95 GB. Here's what I got:

Code:
Image size  	Disc fill %
23,923,326,976	95.6%
23,883,546,624	95.4%
I do get the occasional over-size, and anything that comes in at >99% I re-run with default settings.

All I'm saying is if you use a custom setting of 24000 MB in BD-RB it will fit virtually all the time. This isn't the right thing for everybody, but I feel it works well for me.

And it's not a bug anyway, so I won't belabour the point any more.

[EDIT]And I should say that ALL of my backups are High-Quality, 2-pass, Movie-Only. So it's possible that my results might not apply when doing a Full-Backup, for instance.[/EDIT]

Last edited by RobertM; 24th May 2013 at 20:15.
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Old 24th May 2013, 20:02   #17297  |  Link
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Yep. Too each his/her own. The undersizing is purposeful. Whenever there is variability (especially in estimating muxing overhead, and it is truly an educated guess) I always make sure to err on the side of caution. People get mean when they spend a few hours encoding only to have the output not fit on their target (even when they use a custom size and cause the oversize themselves ).
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Old 24th May 2013, 20:04   #17298  |  Link
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Originally Posted by omegaman7 View Post
I've had Taiyo Yuden discs age at the outer edge. Thankfully, the credits ended up at the edge of the disc I don't even mind undersizing by 1Gb. The difference is negligible, in my opinion. Though I have ran into a few discs, where some material could benefit from that 1Gb, if prioritizing bitrate were possible. Not really hinting here, just an observation.

Though one defect, can compromise a complete backup I no longer use those Disc booklets. Notorious for scratching discs over time. I prefer envelopes, and hard drive backups now.
The ones that really tick me off are the dual-layer backups that start screwing up right in the middle of the movie (at the layer change). These days, though, you can get inexpensive BD-25's for about a nickle more than a Dual Layer DVD+R blank, so I only see it on the occasional test backup.
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Last edited by jdobbs; 24th May 2013 at 20:07.
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Old 24th May 2013, 21:07   #17299  |  Link
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Yeah, I haven't used a Dual layer dvd since I got my first BD burner The BD-9 size, just seems to be agreeable. I plan to play around more though, in an attempt to save hard drive space. I have seen Excellent results under 3Gb. Typically the CGI movies.
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Old 24th May 2013, 21:46   #17300  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdobbs View Post
The ones that really tick me off are the dual-layer backups that start screwing up right in the middle of the movie (at the layer change). These days, though, you can get inexpensive BD-25's for about a nickle more than a Dual Layer DVD+R blank, so I only see it on the occasional test backup.
I agree, it is difficult to get reliable medias, I have had many problems and 95% of them just at the point of changing layers.
Here, "the country of high taxes", this type of media is still a bit expensive.
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