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Old 16th December 2016, 11:47   #41541  |  Link
huhn
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you are lowering quality.

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TV breaks or something?
please...
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Old 16th December 2016, 11:47   #41542  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
For that reason I ask. I read in a forum that with tv 10-bit panel + d3d11 in fullscreen exclusive mode disable it. What happens if I use it disabled? TV breaks or something?


If you disable dithering you are losing information like details and color transition... also dithering prevents banding that can happen even in 10bit


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Old 16th December 2016, 11:50   #41543  |  Link
Damie
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Originally Posted by AngelGraves13 View Post
DXVA scaling should be avoided. Try using Jinc for everything and report back.
Thanks, unticking "use DXVA chroma upscaling when doing native DXVA decoding" did the trick!
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Old 16th December 2016, 11:50   #41544  |  Link
Oguignant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
you are lowering quality.



please...
Jejeje it's a joke. I activate it again.
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Old 16th December 2016, 14:02   #41545  |  Link
Patrik G
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OK after several days of testing picture quality from Blu Ray content on my KRP-500M i have come to the conclusion that NGU for chroma upscaling goes overboard with sharpness.
Picture is too messy with NGU and the resolution looks reduced.
Back to NNEDI3

i have allways thought that there was too much noise in the picture with madvr compared to regular broadcast but i couldnt figure out what setting it was until some days ago
it seems that i have missed two important settings with "Error Diffusion".
i have allways used Error Diffusion 2 with "use color noise" and "change dither for every frame" as both of them was ticked default.
unticked both of them and there goes the annoying noise that has been in the picture.
if its noise now its only there because the movie has it.

i must say that the picture is so good now with Blu Ray when i have found the right combination of settings that i must rewatch every movie

Final settings of what i think maximizes a 9G Kuro Plasma for 1080P Blu Ray content with madvr.

Chroma upscaling: NNEDI3 128
No SuperRes filter (leave it unticked)

"Image upscaling" is not active here with 1080P content on a 1080P display so it doesnt matter what settings you have there.

Rendering:
Smooth Motion Enable (Allways)

Dithering:
Error Diffusion- Option 2
Untick "use colored noise" and "change dither for every frame"

Thats it
THE cleanest/sharpest and most neutral picture i have ever seen on this tv.

Edit:
9G Kuros with Pure Drive and mostly the KRPs are sharp as hell from start so any other sharpening crap as image enhancements or upscaling refinement isnt needed.
Remember 1080 lines of native motion resolution

Last edited by Patrik G; 16th December 2016 at 14:17.
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Old 16th December 2016, 14:54   #41546  |  Link
BluesFanUK
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NNEDI3 128 is OTT, 64 max. The difference isn't noticeable unless you've got hawk eye vision and eats all the power.
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Old 16th December 2016, 16:54   #41547  |  Link
Asmodian
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Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
Disabling everything, the render time goes up by 3 or 4 ms (29 ms max total render time for 2k to 4k with NGU Very high), it's fine for me.
How do you use it? everything disabled too? My gtx 1080 g1 cries!
I run with everything disabled. If you use subtitles enabling "optimize subtitle quality for performance instead of quality" can have a noticeable impact on performance without a significant hit to subtitle quality, but that is the only one I could imagine using with a GTX 1080.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
Quick questiin about dithering...

On 10-bit tv screens with full screen D3D11 exclusive mode is better without dithering? Or is it always better to use ordered dithering?
I know this was already answered but I will do a little rant here too.
Never disable dithering! Anyone who recommends disabling dithering, when using 10-bit output or not, should then be ignored for all other madVR/video playback advice because they obviously don't know what they are talking about.

As CarlosCaco said you are simply losing information with dithering disabled. Ordered dithering, or even random if you want to eliminate the performance hit as much as possible, but never disabled. Disabled is only for testing.
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Old 16th December 2016, 19:14   #41548  |  Link
Oguignant
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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
I run with everything disabled. If you use subtitles enabling "optimize subtitle quality for performance instead of quality" can have a noticeable impact on performance without a significant hit to subtitle quality, but that is the only one I could imagine using with a GTX 1080.



I know this was already answered but I will do a little rant here too.
Never disable dithering! Anyone who recommends disabling dithering, when using 10-bit output or not, should then be ignored for all other madVR/video playback advice because they obviously don't know what they are talking about.

As CarlosCaco said you are simply losing information with dithering disabled. Ordered dithering, or even random if you want to eliminate the performance hit as much as possible, but never disabled. Disabled is only for testing.
About dithering: It was pretty clear to me.

I've been trying out various configuration alternatives. With these options I obtained the best results in the image quality. (Definition, noise, sharpness, etc.) Always in 2k to 4k upscaling. (NNEDI 256 neurons is far away for me).
Another question... What is the limit on the best render time? 30, 40 ms...?

Chroma upscaling NGU high
Image upscaling luma NGU very high
Image upscaling chroma NGU very high
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 30 ms

Chroma upscaling NEDDI3 32 neurons
Image upscaling luma doubling NEDDI64 quadupling 32 neurons
Image upscaling chroma very high
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 29 ms

Chroma upscaling NEDDI3 32 neurons
Image upscaling luma doubling NEDDI128 quadupling 32 neurons
Image upscaling chroma very high
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 38 ms (without dropped frames)

Chroma upscaling NEDDI3 32 neurons
Image upscaling luma doubling NEDDI128 quadupling 32 neurons
Image upscaling chroma Let madvr decide
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 33 ms

Personally, I like it with a touch of enhance detail (1.5) ... but I think they look pretty good as well. What do you think about of these screen shot? Any suggestions?

http://i.imgur.com/mcrqfcT.png
http://i.imgur.com/Uofoc7O.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kZPIthO.png
http://i.imgur.com/USVXgjb.jpg

neddi 128 vs neddi 64 (I do not see much difference)
http://i.imgur.com/PF4gwyx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/9sCgM16.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/tY7BFka.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/nb6dRNr.jpg
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Last edited by Oguignant; 17th December 2016 at 01:44.
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Old 16th December 2016, 21:33   #41549  |  Link
Magik Mark
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Guys,

Is there a way for madvr to run in PLEX?
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Old 16th December 2016, 21:57   #41550  |  Link
Warner306
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Originally Posted by Magik Mark View Post
Guys,

Is there a way for madvr to run in PLEX?
Sort of. Use the Plex for Kodi addon and install Kodi DSPlayer. I'm not sure Plex for Kodi works with DSPlayer, though. DSPlayer needs SMB shares.
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Old 16th December 2016, 22:02   #41551  |  Link
Warner306
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Emby Theater uses madVR as its renderer.

Last edited by Warner306; 16th December 2016 at 22:20.
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Old 16th December 2016, 22:24   #41552  |  Link
foozoor
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Originally Posted by Magik Mark View Post
Is there a way for madvr to run in PLEX?
Why not just using the new "Plex Media Player" based on the player we can't write about (mpv) here?
https://nightlies.plex.tv/public-tes...esting/latest/
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Old 17th December 2016, 04:08   #41553  |  Link
MariaX9
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Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
Another question... What is the limit on the best render time? 30, 40 ms...?
Quote:
To avoid dropped frames and/or presentation glitches the sum of the average stats "deinterlace" (if present), "rendering", and "present" must be a bit below the frame time, Y, in the line "v-sync [X] ms, frame [Y] ms". For example, progressive 29.97 fps video has a new frame every 33.37 ms so "rendering"+"present" needs to be a few ms below 33.37 ms. However, 23.976 fps video only has a new frame every 41.71 ms so you can use more demanding settings with lower frame rate video. Exactly how far below the frame time is required for glitch free playback is dependent on the system but a few milliseconds is usually sufficient.
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=171787
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Old 17th December 2016, 06:14   #41554  |  Link
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Originally Posted by MariaX9 View Post
If I understood correctly, in videos of 23,976fps the best time is always below 41.71 in rendering avg stats? Always without dropped (0) frames or presentation glitches.


Like here...

http://i.imgur.com/PzRQ99q.jpg

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Old 17th December 2016, 07:03   #41555  |  Link
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If I understood correctly, in videos of 23,976fps the best time is always below 41.71 in rendering avg stats? Always without dropped (0) frames or presentation glitches.
Correct, though some dropped frames, delayed frames, or presentation glitches on startup or after seeking are OK.
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Old 17th December 2016, 07:19   #41556  |  Link
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But in this scene, I find NGU high a lot better than Super-xbr 150, even NGU low is better. The pearls are more defined with NGU.
Defined isn't the word I'd use, more like over brightened or vibrant/dynamic. Personally I'm not a fan of what it does for chroma, it doesn't look that good to me in either animated or real world content.

madshi, can you allow 'chroma upscaling algorithm parameter' increase & decrease change super-xbr sharpness settings? madVR says there are no parameters.

Last edited by ryrynz; 17th December 2016 at 07:27.
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Old 17th December 2016, 08:11   #41557  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Correct, though some dropped frames, delayed frames, or presentation glitches on startup or after seeking are OK.
yes. I saw it. I use ctrl+r to reset stats. 1 year ago I use madvr for the first time, but just now i getting a good idea how it works. Is amazong!
The only thing I can not do is that the old movies look good, without noise.

My TV (LG OLED EF9500) has an excellent player (LG Smartshare) but, very limited. (No internal sub ej) But the quality of reproduction is very good, especially in old movies.
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Last edited by Oguignant; 17th December 2016 at 08:19.
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Old 17th December 2016, 08:38   #41558  |  Link
Asmodian
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Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
Defined isn't the word I'd use, more like over brightened or vibrant/dynamic. Personally I'm not a fan of what it does for chroma, it doesn't look that good to me in either animated or real world content.
I think the process of downsampling the chroma tends to dim colors in fine details so NGU's brightening of them is usually correct if compared to an RGB or 4:4:4 original.

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madshi, can you allow 'chroma upscaling algorithm parameter' increase & decrease change super-xbr sharpness settings? madVR says there are no parameters.
super-xbr doubles luma and chroma at the same time, without converting to YCbCr; separating them would cost performance.
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Old 17th December 2016, 08:55   #41559  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
I think the process of downsampling the chroma tends to dim colors in fine details so NGU's brightening of them is usually correct if compared to an RGB or 4:4:4 original.
Yeah I'm aware. Any good 4:4:4 ground truth around?

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super-xbr doubles luma and chroma at the same time, without converting to YCbCr; separating them would cost performance.
Ah, cheers.
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Old 17th December 2016, 09:52   #41560  |  Link
Cinemancave
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I am getting screen tearing in exclusive mode under Windows 7, regardless of the display I use (TV, projector, computer screen). The tearing goes away if I disable exclusive mode. What are the drawbacks of NOT running exclusive mode? My GPU is GeForce 1080.
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