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Old 27th November 2021, 04:24   #62421  |  Link
LenniePaz
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If we have D3D11 chosen in LAV Video, along with choosing the GPU, that enables copy back, correct? My MadVR OSD is still saying D3D11 fullscreen windowed, but shouldn't it say copy back?

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Old 27th November 2021, 08:00   #62422  |  Link
huhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanschneidermann View Post
What can I do when madvr do not work on the second display ?

Windows 11
Driver 496.73
wait for madshi to finish his win 11 build.

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If we have D3D11 chosen in LAV Video, along with choosing the GPU, that enables copy back, correct? My MadVR OSD is still saying D3D11 fullscreen windowed, but shouldn't it say copy back?
the lavfilter d3d11 doesn't affect madVR presentation they are not directly related no decoding setting will change the presenation mode.

the line below at teh end in the ()that tells you where it get's the image/decoded image from which is for nothing copyback, software or even a capture card it just means from the "CPU" doesn't matter where it was before that. d3d11 from a d3d11 application usually a d3d11 decoder and DXVA2 from a d3d9 application.
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Old 27th November 2021, 15:00   #62423  |  Link
LenniePaz
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Originally Posted by huhn View Post
wait for madshi to finish his win 11 build.





the lavfilter d3d11 doesn't affect madVR presentation they are not directly related no decoding setting will change the presenation mode.



the line below at teh end in the ()that tells you where it get's the image/decoded image from which is for nothing copyback, software or even a capture card it just means from the "CPU" doesn't matter where it was before that. d3d11 from a d3d11 application usually a d3d11 decoder and DXVA2 from a d3d9 application.
I don't quite understand what you're saying. Do I have copy back enabled, or no?

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Old 27th November 2021, 16:07   #62424  |  Link
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Hi I got a HP Z27q 27-inch IPS 5K display, see: https://support.hp.com/us-en/document/c04591534
Problem is madVRs identification does show totally wrong values for it:

-> How can I fix this? Is there something to fix?
(to be clear: not the hdr part, but resolution and bit depth)
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Last edited by Selur; 27th November 2021 at 16:15.
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Old 27th November 2021, 19:13   #62425  |  Link
pragmatick
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Has anybody noticed stutters / frame drops lately, perhaps with nivida GPUs? I haven't changed anything on my system lately (apart from installing a new driver) and I'm getting short frame drops / stutters that aren't reported by madVr but clearly visible.
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Old 27th November 2021, 20:25   #62426  |  Link
claw
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Nvidia Control Panel has been changing the options for Power Management and Vertical Sync in recent driver versions.

It used to be with my RTX 2080 Ti and an older driver that I would set
Power to Adaptive
Vertical Sync to ON

With the driver and Control Panel I use with my RTX 3080 Ti, the options are different.

I found this works for me to eliminate the stutter.
Power to Normal
Vertical Sync to Adaptive.

Last edited by claw; 27th November 2021 at 20:30.
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Old 27th November 2021, 23:01   #62427  |  Link
huhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LenniePaz View Post
I don't quite understand what you're saying. Do I have copy back enabled, or no?

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if you choice a GPU for d3d11 it will use copyback.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selur View Post
Hi I got a HP Z27q 27-inch IPS 5K display, see: https://support.hp.com/us-en/document/c04591534
Problem is madVRs identification does show totally wrong values for it:

-> How can I fix this? Is there something to fix?
(to be clear: not the hdr part, but resolution and bit depth)
it's a dual input setup as long as everythign works ignore it.
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Old 28th November 2021, 14:15   #62428  |  Link
Selur
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Quote:
it's a dual input setup as long as everythign works ignore it.
Okay, thanks.
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Old 29th November 2021, 00:10   #62429  |  Link
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Okay, so I have figured out that the "peak brightness" setting in madVR's pixel tone mapping menu means that madVR wont do any tone mapping before the source exceeds the nits chosen. I tried experimenting with it and when the nits is exceeded, it dims the highlighted parts of the picture and makes them a lot dimmer than my TV outputs even with "HDR Tone Mapping" disabled on the TV.

Why would I want this?

My LG C1 is manufactured this month. It is damn bright in HDR10 and Dolby Vision. Even without enabling the TV's own HDR Tone Mapping.

The only sources that exceeds my TV's peak nits are animation movies like "Into the Spider-Verse" and such and not regular movies and TV series.

Most movies report a 1000 nit source as peak nits and I rarely see any higher than 400. Other movies report a 600 nit source. "Into the Spider-Verse" reported almost 10000 as source, but never exceeded around 1000.

There is no write-ups anywhere that explains what any of the settings do except the basic ones from the non-beta branches.

One more question though. Is the TV doing double tone mapping even though I turn off "HDR Tone Mapping" on the TV?

Last edited by Stonga; 29th November 2021 at 13:25. Reason: Edited for clarity
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Old 29th November 2021, 00:33   #62430  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Stonga View Post
I tried experimenting with it and when the nits is exceeded, it dims the highlighted parts of the picture and makes them a lot dimmer than my TV outputs without DTM.

Why would I want this?
Saturation also increases. The LG TVs can get pretty bright with pure white, but a bright pure red (or any color) cannot get that bright.

I don't use madVR's tone mapping for my CX, but that is why you might want to.

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One more question though. Is the TV doing double tone mapping even though I turn it off on the TV?
Yes, you cannot turn off all HDR tone mapping. Dynamic Tone Mapping is more dynamic than it should be. I suggest leaving it off even if using passthrough in madVR.
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Old 29th November 2021, 01:10   #62431  |  Link
Stonga
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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Saturation also increases. The LG TVs can get pretty bright with pure white, but a bright pure red (or any color) cannot get that bright.

I don't use madVR's tone mapping for my CX, but that is why you might want to.

What do you mean by that I might want to use madVR's tone mapping on the C1 and why are you not using it?

I'm not sure even where to start with the settings. I don't need the "best" settings, but something that looks better than the TV can do natively.

Yes, you cannot turn off all HDR tone mapping. Dynamic Tone Mapping is more dynamic than it should be. I suggest leaving it off even if using passthrough in madVR.

I did watch "No Time to Die" from a external HDD in Dolby Vision with HDR Tone Mapping forced enabled through the "Cinema Home" picture mode on the TV since madVR doesn't support Dolby Vision. I have to say it looked pretty good.
From what I understand, LG's own HDR Tone Mapping doesn't only make the highlights brighter, but the whole picture because it isn't dynamic like madVR's pixel shaders?

Thanks for the input and suggestions.

Last edited by Stonga; 29th November 2021 at 13:19. Reason: Edited for clarity
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Old 29th November 2021, 06:29   #62432  |  Link
Asmodian
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Originally Posted by Stonga View Post
LG's own tone mapping doesn't only make the highlights brighter, but the whole picture.
Do you mean Dynamic Tone Mapping? DTM often makes the whole picture brighter, which is why to not use it. If you turn off Dynamic Tone Mapping it will be more faithful to the ideal image within the brightness range it can display, but it will still be doing tone mapping.

I don't use madVR's tone mapping because I haven't found settings that make all content look better than my TV on its own (without DTM). I can tune it to look better for some content, but then I find something else that goes really wrong. LG's never seems to go really bad, at least. madVR's tone mapping is still rather experimental, but I don't watch that much HDR and I haven't tried too hard with recent betas either.
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Old 29th November 2021, 12:52   #62433  |  Link
Stonga
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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Do you mean Dynamic Tone Mapping? DTM often makes the whole picture brighter, which is why to not use it. If you turn off Dynamic Tone Mapping it will be more faithful to the ideal image within the brightness range it can display, but it will still be doing tone mapping.

I'm sorry if I mislead you. When I said "DTM" I meant "HDR Tone Mapping" on the tv OR madVR's pixel shaders. From my understanding is that LG's Tone Mapping is not dynamic like madVR's own Tone Mapping, but static. Or is that the HDR10 limitation vs HDR10+ and Dolby Vision?
I don't even have a setting called "Dynamic Tone Mapping" on my TV. I have "Auto Dynamic Contrast", but I never use that. Looks bad.


I don't use madVR's tone mapping because I haven't found settings that make all content look better than my TV on its own (without DTM). I can tune it to look better for some content, but then I find something else that goes really wrong. LG's never seems to go really bad, at least. madVR's tone mapping is still rather experimental, but I don't watch that much HDR and I haven't tried too hard with recent betas either.
The LG tv got a setting called "HDR Tone Mapping", not " Dynamic Tone Mapping". I guess we're talking about the same thing though?

I have updated all my posts to reflect what I actually meant.

Last edited by Stonga; 29th November 2021 at 14:25. Reason: Edited for clarity
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Old 30th November 2021, 03:07   #62434  |  Link
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Don't know when it happened, but Nvidia's 23hz works really nice now, 23.9759 vs 23.9755 before.

12bit modes also survive reboots
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Old 30th November 2021, 17:48   #62435  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Charky View Post
Has anyone ever experienced dropped frames and presentation glitches caused by... a perfectly still wireless mouse?
I experienced linked (ie : happening at the same time) dropped frames / presentation glitches every 20 seconds or so. Couldn't solve it no matter what settings I tried.
At one point I just had a hunch and switched off my mouse (Logitech MX Anywhere 2S, there is a on/off switch on it).
Problem solved, but the mystery remains…
Does that mouse use the "Options" software? I have this software with my K830 and my MX Master, and it causes presentation glitches when it displays on-screen messages for Caps Lock or Battery Low, but I've never seen do it every x seconds. Try disabling the "battery low" reporting to see if maybe that's the cause. Or report it to Logitech (good luck, their support for bug reports is horrible). Downgrading the mouse software to an older version is also something to try, you never know.
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Old 1st December 2021, 01:32   #62436  |  Link
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Or get their g305, problem solved.
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Old 1st December 2021, 03:53   #62437  |  Link
Asmodian
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Originally Posted by Stonga View Post
The LG tv got a setting called "HDR Tone Mapping", not " Dynamic Tone Mapping". I guess we're talking about the same thing though?
I am not sure now. Maybe they changed the name?
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Old 1st December 2021, 11:55   #62438  |  Link
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I am not sure now. Maybe they changed the name?
I believe they're the same. If it doesn't show in SDR content and only in HDR mode, they should be the same. Don't take my word for it though.

I think the LG C1 actually does a good job with Tone Mapping in HDR10. Not so much with Dolby Vision. The "AI picture" also helps with the highlights in HDR. People should experiment more with it rather than just turning it off from the start. Not to be confused with "AI Brightness" and "AI Genre selection"

Last edited by Stonga; 1st December 2021 at 11:59.
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Old 6th December 2021, 00:14   #62439  |  Link
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Does that mouse use the "Options" software? I have this software with my K830 and my MX Master, and it causes presentation glitches when it displays on-screen messages for Caps Lock or Battery Low, but I've never seen do it every x seconds. Try disabling the "battery low" reporting to see if maybe that's the cause. Or report it to Logitech (good luck, their support for bug reports is horrible). Downgrading the mouse software to an older version is also something to try, you never know.
I downloaded the Logitech Options software the other day and noticed its GUI contains embedded video which triggers LAV Filters to run in the system tray. I'd imagine it has something to do with that -- perhaps LAV is having to filter multiple streams at once.

I had a similar issue with Firefox and YouTube where I can only play a maximum of one video at a time otherwise I can get a few dropped frames every now and then regardless of CPU usage. Even if one of the videos is just a static image with music playing in the background, it still causes some dropped frames with the playback of the video in the active tab.

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MadVR feature request: could we please get a hotkey added to the MadVR hotkeys for "toggle image enhancements on/off". This would be useful for media files which are a little on the soft side and I'd like to add a little sharpening to without having to dig through menus and then remember to turn it off afterwards.

Even better: could we have some functionality where we can place a video settings configuration file inside the folder containing our videos, which MadVR could use only when playing videos inside that folder? eg. suppose you have a whole season of videos which you want to add some sharpening to, then the user doesn't have to remember to toggle it on/off at the beginning of every video.

edit: just saw the tips.txt file which explains how to add tags to media files to automatically apply settings... it seems this may be possible with the [profile=] tag. But.. I've noticed an issue where the enhancements shaders aren't getting applied properly in full screen mode. Specifically, they are applied, but very weakly compared to windowed mode. So weakly that even at max values there is only a slight change in image. In both cases image is downscaled since the source res is higher than my display res (768p) so it's not a pre/post resize thing cause it's being downscaled in both windowed and full screen.

edit2: I'm now thinking it is a pre/post resize thing as I can't explain it any other way. Basically in windowed mode the MadVR enhancements seem to get applied pre-resize, while in full screen mode they are applied post-resize (which makes the enhancements extremely weak and pretty much unusable).

edit3: so I guess this feature request is for a checkbox on the image enhancements page to toggle between applying the enhancements pre/post resize.

edit4: I also observe the anti ringing and anti bloating filters have a much stronger effect when in full screen mode, which is suppressing the sharpening by a huge amount. With those 2 disabled, the result I observe is consistent with full screen mode getting the sharpening filters post-resize and windowed mode getting them pre-resize. Although I'm still not 100% sure if that is the explanation.

Last edited by flossy_cake; 6th December 2021 at 02:00.
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Old 6th December 2021, 03:03   #62440  |  Link
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edit2: I'm now thinking it is a pre/post resize thing as I can't explain it any other way. Basically in windowed mode the MadVR enhancements seem to get applied pre-resize, while in full screen mode they are applied post-resize (which makes the enhancements extremely weak and pretty much unusable).
I'm able to trigger the pre/post resize behaviour by zooming the image in with the numpad 1 and 9 keys in MPC-HC. The threshold appears to be at 1.2 zoom level.

i.e at 1.0 - 1.19 zoom, MadVRs image enhancements shaders appear to be applied pre-resize, while at 1.21+ zoom it appears post-resize (and thus much weaker):

1.0 zoom (image enhancements sharpening enabled to very high values for visibility)


1.19 zoom (no visible change in sharpening compared to 1.0 zoom)


1.21 zoom (the sharpening is now much weaker, and is the same as what appears in full screen mode with zoom 1.0)


However this doesn't appear to be MadVR's fault at all, since the same thing occurs when applying sharpening enhancements through MPC-HC's own shaders dialog.

Therefore I believe MPC-HC may implementing a global rule, something like: if image is scaled by a factor > 1.2x, then apply shaders post-resize, else pre-resize.

I wish to disable this behaviour so that I can control exactly when the shaders are applied at all times.

I have seen MPC-HC's own pre/post resize setting, however that does not change the outcome with respect to the 1.2x threshold.

Last edited by flossy_cake; 6th December 2021 at 03:10.
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