madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[madshi]

Ok, the bug is that the anti-ringing type *should* only be available/visible for image downscaling. It's not supposed to be visible at all for chroma upscaling or image upscaling. So don't worry, this is just a cosmetical bug in the settings dialog. Just ignore that option for chroma/image upscaling. There's only one AR algo available for upscaling. Only downscaling knows 2 different types.

[ryrynz]

Okay. FWIW, super-xbr now looks good with anti-ringing enabled, similar to what it did when it was off in .15.
However anti-ringing off now in .16 isn't looking as good as it was in .15 so looks like super-xbr for chroma needs anti-ringing enabled now for best results.
So it's exactly as you said in the above post, the difference between .15 off and .16 on is pretty minor but nice to have small improvements anyway.
Super-xbr 100 AR is my preferred chroma upscaler.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by ryrynz

Okay. FWIW, super-xbr now looks good with anti-ringing enabled, similar to what it did when it was off in .15. However anti-ringing off now in .16 isn't looking as good as it was in .15 so looks like super-xbr for chroma needs anti-ringing enabled now.

Yes, as I mentioned in the release notes, I've swapped the meaning of the anti-ringing switch for "super-xbr for chroma", because it makes more sense the way it is now. But, with the option checked it should be slightly better now than it was with the option unchecked in .15! Try the "speech bubble" (I think you know what I mean).

[sheppaul]

It is really nice to see your active developments but madVR seems to need a setup wizard for end [normal] users before reaching v1.0.

I know you're doing your best to make it simple but.....

[aufkrawall]

Funny, with .16 I'm experiencing the same problem as described here with .15 + Afterburner:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...87#post1761687
But this time, it also happens without Afterburner. Should I provide debug logs? I can't really use the new version with this behavior.

[GCRaistlin]

Originally Posted by madshi

* fixed: sometimes media player froze during DVD playback

Unfortunately not: http://pastebin.com/LRxRi0Mu

[GCRaistlin]

What is the minimal hardware requirements to play 2160p downscaled to 1080p? On HD5770 with software decoding, I have slow motioned video while audio is being played normally (so audio runs far ahead). If "decoder queue" value is "1-3/16" does it mean that the problem is on decode (LAV Video) side rather that on madVR side?

[Werewolfy]

Thanks for the new version! I will try to test the new features this week end.

Originally Posted by madshi

Does the decoder queue fill with the same video if you disable deinterlacing completely?

Actually, no it's the same behavior BUT I found out if I desactivate Reclock's Pal speedown (24 fps) and play it at 50hz, the queues still don't fill but I have no frampes dropped. So is it only reclock's fault?

I also tested a Blu-Ray with interlaced content and it plays fine, the queues completely filled. So it seems limited to DVD...

Let's me summarize :

-DVD interlaced with Reclock's Pal speedown (24hz) : queues don't fill, frames dropped when render queue drops down.
-DVD interlaced without Reclock's Pal speedown (50hz) : queues don't fill, no frames dropped.
-Blu-Ray interlaced and progressive : queues fill, no frames dropped.
-Other videos : queues fill, no frames dropped.

Do you have an idea to improve the situation with DVD? I can do more tests and videos, juste tell me what to do.

[sneaker_ger]

Originally Posted by GCRaistlin

What is the minimal hardware requirements to play 2160p downscaled to 1080p? On HD5770 with software decoding, I have slow motioned video while audio is being played normally (so audio runs far ahead). If "decoder queue" value is "1-3/16" does it mean that the problem is on decode (LAV Video) side rather that on madVR side?

Yes, the decoding is too slow. (Try LAV 64 bit if you haven't already, it's much faster for HEVC software decoding than the 32 bit version.)

[madshi]

Originally Posted by ryrynz

So it's exactly as you said in the above post, the difference between .15 off and .16 on is pretty minor but nice to have small improvements anyway.
Super-xbr 100 AR is my preferred chroma upscaler.

This is all for chroma, though. For super-xbr image doubling the AR improvement should be bigger.

Originally Posted by sheppaul

It is really nice to see your active developments but madVR seems to need a setup wizard for end [normal] users before reaching v1.0.

I know you're doing your best to make it simple but.....

All in good time.

Originally Posted by aufkrawall

Funny, with .16 I'm experiencing the same problem as described here with .15 + Afterburner:
http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...87#post1761687
But this time, it also happens without Afterburner. Should I provide debug logs? I can't really use the new version with this behavior.

This sounds like an issue which is out of my control. If the problem goes away as soon as an UI element is visible then the chance is rather low that it could be my fault, because (unless you're using FSE) madVR neither cares nor even knows whether an UI element is visible or not.

Do you have the same problem in FSE mode? Have you tried totally closing Afterburner (and any other GPU related tools)?

Originally Posted by GCRaistlin

Unfortunately not: http://pastebin.com/LRxRi0Mu

Ok, at least I can see that my change is "effective", even if it doesn't seem to really help. So right now it seems that either the splitter, decoder or media player is involved in the freeze.

Could you please download the PDB debug symbols for LAV and MPC-HC and create another freeze report with those "installed" (just need to be in the right folder)? Please be extra careful to use the correct PDB symbols, because if they don't match, the freeze report will be useless. The easiest way would probably be to download the latest LAV and MPC-HC builds with matching PDB symbols. Thanks.

Originally Posted by GCRaistlin

What is the minimal hardware requirements to play 2160p downscaled to 1080p? On HD5770 with software decoding, I have slow motioned video while audio is being played normally (so audio runs far ahead). If "decoder queue" value is "1-3/16" does it mean that the problem is on decode (LAV Video) side rather that on madVR side?

If the "decoder queue" is empty that means your decoder is not fast enough. I suppose this is HEVC content? That's very hard to decode in software. Try x64 instead of x86, that's your best bet because the x64 HEVC decoder is noticeably faster than the x86 decoder. If that doesn't help, you'll need a new GPU with HEVC hardware decoding support.

Originally Posted by Werewolfy

Actually, no it's the same behavior BUT I found out if I desactivate Reclock's Pal speedown (24 fps) and play it at 50hz, the queues still don't fill but I have no frampes dropped. So is it only reclock's fault?

I also tested a Blu-Ray with interlaced content and it plays fine, the queues completely filled. So it seems limited to DVD...

Let's me summarize :

-DVD interlaced with Reclock's Pal speedown (24hz) : queues don't fill, frames dropped when render queue drops down.
-DVD interlaced without Reclock's Pal speedown (50hz) : queues don't fill, no frames dropped.
-Blu-Ray interlaced and progressive : queues fill, no frames dropped.
-Other videos : queues fill, no frames dropped.

Do you have an idea to improve the situation with DVD? I can do more tests and videos, juste tell me what to do.

I don't really know why Reclock would effect frame drops, especially when using forced film mode. You could try create a debug log, then I can have a look for which exact reason the frames were dropped. Remind me: The OSD does list the frame drops, right? If it doesn't, the debug log won't help.

I don't know why the queues don't fill. That's a question you'd have to ask the decoder developer (not sure if it's nevcairiel in your case?). Maybe the DVD Navigator somehow limits this? I've no idea, I believe it's totally outside of my control.

[aufkrawall]

Originally Posted by madshi

This sounds like an issue which is out of my control. If the problem goes away as soon as an UI element is visible then the chance is rather low that it could be my fault, because (unless you're using FSE) madVR neither cares nor even knows whether an UI element is visible or not.

Do you have the same problem in FSE mode? Have you tried totally closing Afterburner (and any other GPU related tools)?

I tested again and it was still Afterburner. Situation was a bit different, this time FSE works without drops and it seems like it was important that Afterburner was never already started once during the Windows session.
So, FSE works for me. Hope it remains that way.

[huhn]

is it normal that super XBR can be really slow depending on the scene?

i'm talking about 50 % GPU to ~95% (dropping frames) reproduce able. the bus interface is spiking at the same time from 2-8 % to 22-60%.

and it looks like Vram usage is a lot higher too with that version or not stable. i'm not sure yet. even with a render queue of 4 i'm kind of capped.

what so ever i have huge troubles with 90.16.

[Werewolfy]

Originally Posted by madshi

I don't really know why Reclock would effect frame drops, especially when using forced film mode. You could try create a debug log, then I can have a look for which exact reason the frames were dropped. Remind me: The OSD does list the frame drops, right? If it doesn't, the debug log won't help.

I don't know why the queues don't fill. That's a question you'd have to ask the decoder developer (not sure if it's nevcairiel in your case?). Maybe the DVD Navigator somehow limits this? I've no idea, I believe it's totally outside of my control.

Yes the OSD does list the frame drops. I will create a debug log this week end.

I use LAV Filters so yes I will ask nevcairiel.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by huhn

is it normal that super XBR can be really slow depending on the scene?

i'm talking about 50 % GPU to ~95% (dropping frames) reproduce able. the bus interface is spiking at the same time from 2-8 % to 22-60%.

and it looks like Vram usage is a lot higher too with that version or not stable. i'm not sure yet. even with a render queue of 4 i'm kind of capped.

what so ever i have huge troubles with 90.16.

No that's not normal. I see no reason why super-xbr should depend on the scene. Are you sure it's not something else, like e.g. black bar detection? Although that would affect CPU, not GPU. If there really is a problem, I'll need more information. E.g. does it work if you restore default settings (other than super-xbr)? And if you go back to v0.90.15 the problem totally goes away?

Are you saying v0.90.16 is wasting GPU RAM, maybe even leaking it? How do v0.90.15 and v0.90.16 compare in that area?

[nevcairiel]

Originally Posted by Werewolfy

I use LAV Filters so yes I will ask nevcairiel.

LAV really has no influence on this. It just decodes frames it gets from the source and sends them onwards. DVD decoding is already optimized for latency because the DVD Navigator is known to bug out when the latency is too high - which is what might simply be happening here.
To further reduce latency, I would recommend to use software decoding in LAV Video for DVDs, its only SD MPEG-2, any recent CPU laughs at that, and it reduces latency a bit.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by nevcairiel

LAV really has no influence on this. It just decodes frames it gets from the source and sends them onwards. DVD decoding is already optimized for latency because the DVD Navigator is known to bug out when the latency is too high - which is what might simply be happening here.

So the LAV Splitter is not involved at all here? The DVD Navigator does all the work? Can you provide a bit more information on your experience with latency being a problem? Could that explain why Werewolfy has problems when letting Reclock change 25fps to 24fps?

[nevcairiel]

Originally Posted by madshi

So the LAV Splitter is not involved at all here? The DVD Navigator does all the work? Can you provide a bit more information on your experience with latency being a problem? Could that explain why Werewolfy has problems when letting Reclock change 25fps to 24fps?

Yes, the DVD Navigator does all the work. And it is limited in how far it allows to "desync" the video/audio streams, ie. how many video frames you can pull out of it before it waits for audio to also be consumed.

In short, it won't let you queue up as many frames as you want, so the decode queue running low is not necessarily unexpected if the frames get drained instantly into all the other queues and you hit the limit from the DVD Navigator then.

[GCRaistlin]

Originally Posted by madshi

Could you please download the PDB debug symbols for LAV and MPC-HC and create another freeze report with those "installed" (just need to be in the right folder)?

I've updated the freeze report: http://pastebin.com/LRxRi0Mu

[James Freeman]

Thank you for the new build.

Wow, the anti-bloating thing is great!
Basically a high-pass filter before the Sharpening algorithm right? Isn't something similar is already part of these sharpening algorithms, or you just let us play with the value inside the algorithm?
To me it looks much closer to how my eye would see detail in reality once I find the right % value.

With 1080p content I like AdaptiveSharpen at 1.0-1.5 with anti-bloating 75% to 100%.
It reveals the net under the actors wigs, skin pores, bad shave and much more fine detail we probably not intended to see.

[bcec]

some questions just so I make sure I understand these right:
1) What's the difference between processing > image enhancements, vs upscaling refinement? first applying non-upscaled image, and latter applying upscaled image? If both are set, two sets of image enhancements/refinement done?
2) For upscale refinements, is it preferred to refine after every 2x, or the final image?

cheers!