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Old 11th October 2018, 03:24   #53161  |  Link
el Filou
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blaubart View Post
Unfortunately TV manufacturers give their HDMI levels randomly changing phantasy names. The one that sounds somehow lower, weaker is mostly 0-255.
On most TVs I've seen, the setting's results are consistent with its name and values, the 'issue' is that some TVs call the setting "range" in which case the bigger sounding one is 0-255, when other TVs call the setting "black level" in which case 0-255 is the lower sounding one. You just have to RTFM really.
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Old 11th October 2018, 07:58   #53162  |  Link
blaubart
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Googl for rtfm, ok reading the f.. manual - nothing concrete. Reading a Prad technican who said it is not as easy as switching 0-255 / 16-235 but the TV is "trying" to higher-lower some curves in that direction with changing success. Which does not mean that some levels/colors are completely "terminated" its more like smooth waves.. I think thats the reason why TV manuals never tell us hard numbers but somewhat deeeeper, wiiiider In the end it lies in the eye of the each person.

Thinking about the "black-ish" HDR thing I remembered that madshi told me once (Aug.2016 in an other language) he would not recommend YCbCr but at this time he had no UHD panel. But to have a chance for 10-Bit video you need YCbCr422 at 10 or 12 bpc (bit per channel). As I could read the "RGB hardliners" hate that, running in squares through the room tearing their hair out, trying 444 10-bit through HDMI2 whatever..

So maybe madshi just did not test much in YCbCr (hoping he finally got some HDR TV). Win10 set to HDR with GPU output "RGB full" shows here pale greenish colors on the desktop (video ok) but as I mentioned above setting TV's HDMI black level to Normal - madVR playing HDR at 0-255 now dark scenes ok. YCbCr422 12 bpc - HDR desktop has much better colors but madVR's black clipping comes too early 2-10% is black -16% nearly black.

Last edited by blaubart; 11th October 2018 at 08:02.
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Old 11th October 2018, 10:57   #53163  |  Link
mytbyte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
1809 is pulled is well known to be broken and has yet another WDDM version so expect a lot of driver problems.
https://youtu.be/uOxmONFwsG4?t=72



(sorry, had to...)
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Old 11th October 2018, 11:36   #53164  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blaubart View Post
Googl for rtfm, ok reading the f.. manual - nothing concrete. Reading a Prad technican who said it is not as easy as switching 0-255 / 16-235 but the TV is "trying" to higher-lower some curves in that direction with changing success. Which does not mean that some levels/colors are completely "terminated" its more like smooth waves.. I think thats the reason why TV manuals never tell us hard numbers but somewhat deeeeper, wiiiider In the end it lies in the eye of the each person.
you didn't read every Manuel that is there.
my TV has full normal and auto and all 3d do exactly what you would understand under these names and there is no wave what ever going on this is a very simple thing for a Tv and a well understood topic.
Quote:
Thinking about the "black-ish" HDR thing I remembered that madshi told me once (Aug.2016 in an other language) he would not recommend YCbCr but at this time he had no UHD panel. But to have a chance for 10-Bit video you need YCbCr422 at 10 or 12 bpc (bit per channel). As I could read the "RGB hardliners" hate that, running in squares through the room tearing their hair out, trying 444 10-bit through HDMI2 whatever..
but HDMI 2.0 can send 12 bit RGB@UHD.
can you please stop making stuff up?
Quote:
So maybe madshi just did not test much in YCbCr (hoping he finally got some HDR TV). Win10 set to HDR with GPU output "RGB full" shows here pale greenish colors on the desktop (video ok) but as I mentioned above setting TV's HDMI black level to Normal - madVR playing HDR at 0-255 now dark scenes ok. YCbCr422 12 bpc - HDR desktop has much better colors but madVR's black clipping comes too early 2-10% is black -16% nearly black.
if your don't send RGB from the GPU you are at the mercy of the GPU driver. and again it is a very easy topic. you throw full range RGb at the GPU driver and it will amke limited range YCbCr out of it. nothing new.
and because you have troubles with this topic don't assume other HDR TVs and other use have the same problems.
and YCbCr a thing with 1080p TVs and what do you evne test it is not in his hands what the GPU driver does.
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Old 11th October 2018, 12:05   #53165  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8 View Post


any ideas why the picture changes to black and white for me as soon as I set "highlight recovery strength" to anything else than 'none'?
Exactly same problem here !

MPC-HC 1.7.13 (x86&x64)
MADVR 0.92.17
Geforce 650Ti
DL580G5 (4xXeonX7460)
Win10 1803

it worked fine before (DirectCompute ?)
And it possible to be able to choose the old algo ?

Last edited by vanden; 11th October 2018 at 12:07.
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Old 11th October 2018, 12:30   #53166  |  Link
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why don't you upgrade to MPC-HC 1.8.3, that fixed some things for me (not related to MadVR, however)...
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Old 11th October 2018, 13:04   #53167  |  Link
vanden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mytbyte View Post
why don't you upgrade to MPC-HC 1.8.3, that fixed some things for me (not related to MadVR, however)...
Because it does not change anything ! :


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Old 11th October 2018, 14:08   #53168  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanden View Post
Because it does not change anything ! :


Madshi knows about this and tries to do something about it.
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Old 11th October 2018, 14:26   #53169  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warner306 View Post
Your GPU doesn't support DirectCompute, which highlight recovery uses, or your extremely high rendering times could be causing this.
https://www.geforce.com/hardware/not...specifications

directcompute should be supported

I cant play 4k resolution downscaled anyway, but even when I make a 1080p x265 HDR encode from my source which plays smoothly I get the same result.
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Old 11th October 2018, 16:58   #53170  |  Link
Klaus1189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
HDMI 2.0 can send 12 bit RGB@UHD.
can you please stop making stuff up?
This is correct, but there is something missing.

There are more specs to look at here:
1.) resolution -> UHD - 3840x2160
2.) color depth -> 12 bit per color
3.) Pixelformat -> RGB (no subsampling) or YCbCr 4:4:4 / 4:2:2 / 4:2:0
4.) matching refresh rate for framerate of video -> missing here

It is supported by HDMI 2.0, but only for low refresh rates.

The bandwidth of HDMI 2.0 is known and so you can calculate it by yourself, it isn't that hard
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Old 11th October 2018, 17:13   #53171  |  Link
mkohman
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Hi Guys, I recently upgraded my projector from an x5900 to an x9900 and so far I'm loving it. I have always preferred madVR tone mapping via pixel shades and find that 200 target nits with highlight recovery at (are you mad?) and balanced for the other setting gives me the best results.. However.. I find that the actual picture is lacking in colour it's pale and looks desaturated even with the Option at 35%.

Yesterday I went into the madVR settings and upped the saturation from 0 to 22 and I am absolutely loving what is on my screen. I have full pop as HDR should be and I have never seen HDR this great on a projector with accurate colour, shadow details, highlights blacks etc etc... Thank you to
@madshi
and all the fantastic members on here who always help and support this amazing piece of software.

What I wanted to ask was by having my saturation at 22 is that ok? Will it cause an issue like picture noise etc? I haven't seen any I'll effects but am I the only one who finds that at 0 saturation the HDR looks a little lifeless? Would really appreciate some comments and feedback to help me understand better.. By the way I select 0-255, 10 bit or above, BT2020, powercurve 2.4 within MadVR and RGB 4.4.4 on my HTPC at 10bit for 24hz movies.. Here are some pics with the +22 within madVR.. Thanks for all your help...


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Old 11th October 2018, 17:16   #53172  |  Link
blaubart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
but HDMI 2.0 can send 12 bit RGB@UHD.
can you please stop making stuff up?
puuh why so angry? In the states they want 60Hz.
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Old 11th October 2018, 17:35   #53173  |  Link
Warner306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8 View Post
https://www.geforce.com/hardware/not...specifications

directcompute should be supported

I cant play 4k resolution downscaled anyway, but even when I make a 1080p x265 HDR encode from my source which plays smoothly I get the same result.
I would still guess it has something to do with Direct Compute or the version of it used by your GPU, but madshi would have to say for sure.
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Old 11th October 2018, 17:45   #53174  |  Link
mrmojo666
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blaubart View Post
puuh why so angry? In the states they want 60Hz.
tv is interlaced 60i, so no worries imho
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Old 11th October 2018, 18:10   #53175  |  Link
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Originally Posted by mrmojo666 View Post
tv is interlaced 60i, so no worries imho
Sorry, but it is very humble. There is not only 50i/60i.
Every "flatscreen" (-> LCD/OLED/...) is native progressive.
Only old CRTs were able to display interlaced content natively.
AND the deinterlacers of TVs are not as good as software deinterlacers, just try them in comparison and we continue here.
I tested also 20k TVs (20k is not the resolution )
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Old 11th October 2018, 18:57   #53176  |  Link
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Is it only me but has anyone else using 92.17 and that last xysubfilter build 3.1.0.752 found that madVRs ability to move subtitles into the black bars stopped? The option is moving subtitles down to the bottom of the movie but not into the black bars when they are there. I'm using LAV 0.73 in case thats important also.

Last edited by Razoola; 12th October 2018 at 18:28.
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Old 11th October 2018, 18:59   #53177  |  Link
mytbyte
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Originally Posted by mrmojo666 View Post
tv is interlaced 60i, so no worries imho
Come on, what about UHD sports @ 50/60 fps????
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Old 11th October 2018, 19:33   #53178  |  Link
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The abuse of "quote" and "img" tags is too damn high. Polluters.
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Old 11th October 2018, 19:39   #53179  |  Link
huhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaus1189 View Post
This is correct, but there is something missing.

There are more specs to look at here:
1.) resolution -> UHD - 3840x2160
2.) color depth -> 12 bit per color
3.) Pixelformat -> RGB (no subsampling) or YCbCr 4:4:4 / 4:2:2 / 4:2:0
4.) matching refresh rate for framerate of video -> missing here

It is supported by HDMI 2.0, but only for low refresh rates.

The bandwidth of HDMI 2.0 is known and so you can calculate it by yourself, it isn't that hard
remind me of thsi line again when you come up with i want to learn.
i well know the HDMI spec.

Quote:
Sorry, but it is very humble. There is not only 50i/60i.
Every "flatscreen" (-> LCD/OLED/...) is native progressive.
Only old CRTs were able to display interlaced content natively.
AND the deinterlacers of TVs are not as good as software deinterlacers, just try them in comparison and we continue here.
I tested also 20k TVs (20k is not the resolution
the sony OLEd can do interlanced natively

and what software deinterlancer are you using in realtime which your HTPC?
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Old 11th October 2018, 20:07   #53180  |  Link
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Originally Posted by mytbyte View Post
Come on, what about UHD sports @ 50/60 fps????
aren't they interlaced ? so what's the point of this discussion ? better 60i to deinterlaced 60/2 fps UHD rgb 10bit 4:4:4 or deinterlaced 60/2*2 fps UHD rgb 8bit 4:4:4 or 60i deinterlaced 60/2*2 fps UHD YCbCr 4:2:2 ? who knows? could be personal decision ? until hdmi stardad is like that, ppl have to deal with.
always imho
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