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Old 10th February 2013, 16:07   #2221  |  Link
Garrog
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Hi MrC et al. Apologies if the answer to this should be staring me in the face, but does AVStoDVD allow me to edit (trim start/end length) before transcoding? I could edit the AVStoDVD output with VOBblanker but clearly if I can edit before conversion I would avoid unnecessary transcoding of junk I intend to just throw away! I've looked through the help files and on-line and keep seeing references to AviSynth - but that seems to be a stand-alone script tool and not being a programmer I would need a GUI, which brings me back to AVStoDVD... ?!? If anyone can clear up my confusion then thanks!
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Old 10th February 2013, 16:59   #2222  |  Link
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Well, the answer is not exactly staring you right in the face, but it is certainly there...

From the AVStoDVD help file (clip preview):
Quote:
Set Trim Start (available only if Clip Preview Window is accessed from Edit Title Window)
Shortcut: CTRL+A
Set Trim End (available only if Clip Preview Window is accessed from Edit Title Window)
Shortcut: CTRL+Z
Load your clip, go to the "Edit Title -> AVISynth" window, uncheck "Auto AVISynth Script" and click the "Preview Title Output" button in the lower left corner. Select your start and end frames, close the preview, and voilą, the script now contains the corresponding trim command.


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Old 10th February 2013, 18:50   #2223  |  Link
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Ah...thanks manolito, shame it only has more basic settings (e.g. no speed setting) but useful as an initial tool!

However, I've noticed a problem - after setting the trim points, when I go back to the main window and preview the trim points seem to have shifted about 50 secs or so later in time! I tested on internal and external players just to confirm with same results.

Any idea if that's a known bug or some kind of tweak that's needed, or do people set trim points by factoring in the error?

Thanks!

Last edited by Garrog; 12th February 2013 at 14:04. Reason: More polite!
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Old 11th February 2013, 20:49   #2224  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrog View Post
However, I've noticed a problem - after setting the trim points, when I go back to the main window and preview the trim points seem to have shifted about 50 secs or so later in time! I tested on internal and external players just to confirm with same results.
It should not happen, of course. Could you elaborate better the steps, maybe with some screenshots? The source title properties may help too.



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Old 12th February 2013, 00:08   #2225  |  Link
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Thanks, sounds like it's not an expected issue - the program is on the other machine so can't do right now, but I will get some more info to hopefully find out what's going wrong! Chat soon.
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Old 12th February 2013, 13:22   #2226  |  Link
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Ok so I went back and tried it again with no problems. But then I remembered what I did the first time:

1. I set the trim points as Manolito described

2. I returned to the main page and hit the preview button

3. Now this is where it gets a bit foggy. I definitely remember not being happy with the trim points but I'll come back to that later.

4. Now this is looking like the interesting part: I re-opened "View/Edit Title Settings" and changed the trim points. Again I can't remember clearly on this occasion whether I cleared the settings by setting the "Auto AviSynth Script" check box or if I just went straight in working from with the previously modified script. (As you probably know/designed, opening the "Preview" in this case will show you the edit you previously made, i.e. the modified script, rather than the original source unmodified.) But see below for subsequent tests.

5. After changing the trim points I exited the editor and previewed as before. This is where I found the trim errors, and estimated the error by comparing with the original.

To keep things clear I will open up a second post to continue with subsequent test results...
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Old 12th February 2013, 14:00   #2227  |  Link
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Subsequent Tests

Today as I said above, I loaded the original file into AVStoDVD, set the trim points, returned to the main screen and previewed with no error.

Looking back, I think yesterday I may have been confused and imagined that the errors had shown on both the first and second edits. I still can't be certain but the evidence today suggests there probably wasn't any errors the first time and I probably performed the re-edit solely because I just wasn't happy with my own edit points. Assuming that's the case then apologies for any confusion caused!

Ok, on to today's findings:

So today I remembered that I had re-edited, so I went back and tried that. I did this both with (A) and without (B) resetting the script, shutting down the program in between to clear any session settings.

In case A I found that the error appeared very similar to the results yesterday, i.e. approx 50 second shift.

In case B it appeared that only the first trim point had shifted.

I'm sure you will want to perform your own tests to verify, and I suspect that you will be able to generate your own data more easily and reliably (!) but please let me know if I can be any further help.

Thanks for your help, and can I say I do find it a great program! (AviSynth player speed setting and audio fades would be nice tho...*cough* )
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Old 12th February 2013, 14:58   #2228  |  Link
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@Garrog

thanks for the kind words.... but to fully understand, I would have a better explanation of the steps required to replicate the issue. Do not put anything about what you have done yesterday or today, just put the minimal steps to replicate the issue.

I need the source title properties too. The screenshot of AVStoDVD main window with the loaded source title is ok.



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Old 12th February 2013, 16:05   #2229  |  Link
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Ok, apologies if that was a little long-winded, I just wanted to be clear about all the facts for clarity! Thanks for your help.

Minimal steps (now reduced through further testing!):

1. Load video into AVStoDVD (in this case XVid Mpeg-4: see attached)
2. Open Title Edit window (via button)
3. Go to AviSynth tab, deselect "Auto AviSynth script"
4. Select "Preview Title Output" (button)
5. Move cursor to trim start position by any means, set trim start (button)
6. "........................" end position ".............................." end (button)
7. Exit Preview window (into Title Edit window)
8. Select and deselect "Auto AviSynth Script" (resets script without trim)
9. Repeat steps 4 to 7.
10. Preview video either here or from main page, observing timing error.
Attached Images
  

Last edited by Garrog; 12th February 2013 at 16:05. Reason: Correction
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Old 13th February 2013, 17:40   #2230  |  Link
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Ah, please note I'm still using v2.5.1 - I've just noticed you recently released 2.6.1, perhaps you could confirm whether this occurs in the new version? Thanks!
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Old 14th February 2013, 11:09   #2231  |  Link
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Hi Garrog,

thanks for the detailed sequence. Now I can replicate the issue and you are perfectly right, upon toggling off the 'Auto AviSynth Script', the Trim configuration is not completely reset, resulting in frames shifting.

I will fix that in the next release.

Good job!



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Old 14th February 2013, 13:18   #2232  |  Link
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Excellent, thanks Mr. C!
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Old 5th March 2013, 22:30   #2233  |  Link
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Thanks for your help
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Old 8th March 2013, 17:12   #2234  |  Link
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You are welcome, whatever your request was....



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Old 6th April 2013, 13:01   #2235  |  Link
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Hi, I'm using AVStoDVD to convert a NTSC Blu Ray to PAL DVD.
I have a quick question : is it correct to use PAL speedup option (avisynth AssumeFPS) with that kind of source?
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Old 6th April 2013, 13:51   #2236  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *ale* View Post
Hi, I'm using AVStoDVD to convert a NTSC Blu Ray to PAL DVD.
I have a quick question : is it correct to use PAL speedup option (avisynth AssumeFPS) with that kind of source?
If the source is NTSC-film (23.976 fps), yes, you can use that option.



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Old 6th April 2013, 14:16   #2237  |  Link
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Yes the source is progressive NTSC-film (23.976 fps); what I mean is whether it is preferable to use speedup or DGPulldown

thanks
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Old 6th April 2013, 17:02   #2238  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *ale* View Post
Yes the source is progressive NTSC-film (23.976 fps); what I mean is whether it is preferable to use speedup or DGPulldown
This is mainly a matter of taste and personal preferences...

The DGPulldown method has the advantage that audio can be left alone. But you will get repeated frames which annoys a lot of people. In PAL land people are not used to this judder. And according to neuron2 NTSC to PAL conversion using pulldown flags is more noticeable to the viewer than NTSC pulldown, because the repeated fields are more evenly spread in NTSC pulldown.

The PAL speedup method is much more common, all professional authoring houses do it that way. The slightly faster video cannot be detected by most people, but audio can be a problem. Especially for music content many people can hear that the audio plays faster and at a higher pitch.

Lately you will often find sped up audio which has been pitch corrected so it will still play faster, but at the original pitch. But as a trade off you might get audible artifacts. Pitch correction is very complicated, there are different algorithms for vocals and polyphonic music, and you may still end up with audio glitches.

Just the other day I did such a conversion using PAL speedup. For the audio I used BeSweet and its soundtouch plugin which can speed up the audio without altering the pitch. It was a concert video, and the audio came out terribly. I tried it again, this time using Prosoniq Timefactory. It sounded much better, but there were still audible problems. So I ended up not preserving the original pitch which delivered a quality which was undistinguishable from the original.

AFAIK AVStoDVD speeds up the audio while not doing any pitch correction, so you will not have to deal with audio glitches. But it will only work for you if you can live with the slightly higher pitch. Check it out for yourself...


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Old 11th April 2013, 21:27   #2239  |  Link
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@manolito

are you aware of any AviSynth filters designed to speed up the audio w/o altering the pitch? That could be a nice add-on to AVStoDVD, if the results are good enough.



Bye

P.S. Many thanks for the German translation update.
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Old 11th April 2013, 23:38   #2240  |  Link
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Quote:
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@manolito

are you aware of any AviSynth filters designed to speed up the audio w/o altering the pitch? That could be a nice add-on to AVStoDVD, if the results are good enough.
Oh yes, the timestretch filter is able to do this.

Quote:
TimeStretch(tempo = (100.0*25.0*1001.0)/24000.0)
This will change the tempo from Film speed to PAL speed without changing the pitch.

You also might want to consider to replace the ResampleAudio filter with the SSRC filter.

Quote:
SSRC Shibata Sample Rate Converter is a resampler. Audio is always converted to float. This filter will result in better audio quality than ResampleAudio.
It uses SSRC by Naoki Shibata, which offers the best resample quality available.

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