AMD, Intel and Nvidia driver issues and last recommended version

[NikosD]

People and users of this forum don't seem to understand even the basics of the covered monopoly game of Intel and nVidia.
Both these companies during the last few decades (!) were spending a huge amount of money in marketing and PR (BRIBING) of tech journalists and OEMs in order to do two simple things:

1) Avoid AMD's products inside their devices (OEMs) even if they are better (recent example of Ryzen processors in laptops, EPYC processors in servers etc and Threadrippers in HEDT) and exaggerate over any weakness (tech journalists) compared to theirs (Intel & nVidia) - recent example of 5% faster Intel processors in 1080p gaming.

2) Produce a lot of hype for their products even for useless features (hairworks, physx, RTX in 2018 for nVidia/ AI, AVX-512 inside Tiger lake and desktop processors for Intel etc) and bury or underestimate any AMD's better feature.

So, even after a desktop processor of 8C/16T for desktop Zen1 Ryzen which later became 16T/32T for Zen 2 even after a 32C/64T processor for servers which later became 64C/128T processor and the same for HEDT market with Threadrippers, the OEMs and tech journalists didn't have any intense positive reaction.

No overloaded hype was created, no inflated prices for AMD products.
Even for the best of the best CPU processors that mankind has ever created by far - the whole Zen 2 architecture implementations - no particular hype was ever created by OEMs and tech journalists.
Because Intel spends BILLIONS of $$$ to BRIBE these two - OEMs and tech journalists.
The margins of AMD are still low - even for Zen 2 CPUs.
So, after the next release of the absolute monster of CPU processors, the divine Zen 3 CPUs that will be released on 8th of October, no extraordinary hype will be created, no limited stock by design, no inflated prices.
Just the best processor you could ever have, in right stock and price.
The same with GPUs although not even this time nVidia is in position of Intel, unfortunately...

[VBB]

Originally Posted by el Filou

After reading this KB article: https://nvidia.custhelp.com/app/answ...tail/a_id/5072 (linked to in the release notes for the last drivers), as they're suggesting to sync the Windows HDR setting with the application HDR setting (in this case, madVR), I am under the impression that NVIDIA is trying to dynamically switch Windows HDR itself on or off. Don't know if this is correct but clearly something has changed compared to the old NVHDR way that directly controlled the display from the app.

Yeah, I'm sure MS is pushing OS HDR, and Nvidia will likely abandon their API eventually. With this new driver, though, at least madVR is still able to use NV HDR.

[el Filou]

Originally Posted by NikosD

2) Produce a lot of hype for their products even for useless features and bury or underestimate any [competitor]'s better feature.

Congrats, you just described marketing. Every company is doing it when they can, even AMD. Remember the x3 multitexturing no devs used? Truform tessellation? AVIVO that wasn't even fixed-function video decode? TrueAudio? The one-die 4-cores when Intel "used glue" for its 4-cores even though it didn't matter much as the market for 4-cores was so small at the time? The supposedly "future-proof 8-core" FXs ?

So, even after a desktop processor of 8C/16T for desktop Zen1 Ryzen which later became 16T/32T for Zen 2 even after a 32C/64T processor for servers which later became 64C/128T processor and the same for HEDT market with Threadrippers, the OEMs and tech journalists didn't have any intense positive reaction.

That's because for most consumer workloads until now, adding more cores had diminishing returns apart from things like two-pass video encoding (live encoding for streaming is best done on the GPU), 3D rendering, and pure compute, which are things most people aren't doing. Maybe it will change now even consoles have 8 cores and games start using them, but until now it wasn't a game changer. And no, the journalists did have intense positive reaction for the high-core count AMD models, but only for specific use cases.

"best of the best CPU processors that mankind has ever created" ... "absolute monster" ... "divine"

You do realize you're talking like someone who's in a cult, right?

[Klaus1189]

If there wasn‘t AMD, mainstream Intel would still have 4c/8t...

[huhn]

yes AMD was the reason that intel didn't need to bring more cores to the market.

[almawdah]

So what the recommended , can we upgrade the driver to latest driver for nvidia to use it with MadVR ??

[Manni]

Originally Posted by almawdah

So what the recommended , can we upgrade the driver to latest driver for nvidia to use it with MadVR ??

I've only tested 8bits RGB with 456.38 (Studio / Standard) as that's what I use and don't have the time to do any other tests at the moment, but at least with that I can confirm that HDR works fine (with nvAPI) and that if using passthrough the HDR10 metadata is sent properly.

I don't know how it behaves in 12bits or in YCC.

[EDIT: Also I'm still using CRU so I haven't tested native frame rate.]

I don't have the issue of the "double switch" for HDR. It switches seamlessly between SDR and HDR, or SDR BT2020 and HDR passthrough.

So at least at first sight, it seems good to go

I'll post if I find any issue.

My full config is in my sig, YMMV.

[el Filou]

Originally Posted by Klaus1189

If there wasn‘t AMD, mainstream Intel would still have 4c/8t...

But they only started releasing mainstream CPUs with more than 4 cores when AMD became competitive overall, it wasn't just the mere existence of more than 4 cores from AMD that made them do it: Phenom IIs had 6-core versions on the mainstream platform, but that didn't cause Intel to release mainstream 6-cores, they reserved them for the HEDT platform.
My point is that what's important is if the number of cores can actually benefit your use cases. It's good that AMD was able to release a 16-core on a mainstream platform with Zen 2, but with mainstream apps (i.e. Web, games, productivity apps) you hardly see the benefit anyway, heck in some cases the 12- and 16-cores can be slower than the 8-core. So while you have to salute the technological prowess, and 16 cores can be useful for content creators or devs or people who run a whole lab in VMs, I see no need for journalists to have an "intense reaction" (or is that a euphemism for something?).

[almawdah]

Originally Posted by Manni

I've only tested 8bits RGB as that's what I use and don't have the time to do any other tests at the moment, but at least with that I can confirm that HDR works fine (with nvAPI) and that if using passthrough the HDR10 metadata is sent properly.

I don't know how it behaves in 12bits or in YCC.

I don't have the issue of the "double switch" for HDR. It switches seamlessly between SDR and HDR, or SDR BT2020 and HDR passthrough.

So at least at first sight, it seems good to go

I'll post if I find any issue.

My full config is in my sig, YMMV.

Thanks very much brother


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Manni]

Originally Posted by almawdah

Thanks very much brother


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You're welcome

One last thing, I'm still using CRU so I haven't tested native frame rate.

I'll edit my post to reflect that.

[SamuriHL]

Originally Posted by VBB

chros, SamuriHL, when you get a chance, could you please test YCbCr 444 8-bit with HDR to see if you also get that green screen issue? Thanks!

Oh for crying out loud. LOL Yea I can look into it in a bit. That requires a lot of setup. lol

[VBB]

What do you have to change? I appreciate it. I'll do some more testing tonight. Perhaps it just requires a reboot on my end, which I didn't get to last night.

[SamuriHL]

I still haven't rebooted, either and probably should. As for what I have to change, a bunch of crap. LOL First YCbCr 444 mode, then changing to PC mode on the TV, which apparently reset all my damn picture settings completely screwing up my calibration (SIGH, screw you LG)....Now that I fixed all that and set it up, I threw on 1917 just to test it. No green, and PQ looks pretty damn impressive. This isn't a movie where I'm likely to notice a lot of banding so, um, you're making me mad by having me test this seeing how good it COULD look if LG hadn't completely blew it on PC mode. LOL So uh yea thanks for that

[VBB]

LOL well thanks for letting me now that it works for you. I'm sure you do know that PC mode is completely separate as far as settings and calibration go. On my C7, the two modes even need different brightness settings to have the same black level.

Also, I noticed again last night that YCbCr 4:4:4 actually has very, very little banding in both SDR and HDR, in PC mode. That's why I'm now trying to get it to work.

[SamuriHL]

Yes I do know that which is why I said I had a bunch of setup to do. Not HARD to do but I just had to remember everything to set without looking. Anyway, it wasn't a big deal and I was able to test it.

I'd have to do a lot more testing on that theory. PC mode has been an unmitigated mess for LG. ALL of us have WANTED it to work but we've always found issues. I'm assuming you're sticking to 8 bit for this venture yes?

[VBB]

Oh, 8-bit for sure. It's pretty much established now that PC mode switches the TV into 8-bit mode anyway, and of course my old C7 and GTX 960 can't do full chroma at higher than 60Hz anyway. And, as we know by now, the new Nvidia driver did not enable 10-bit for anything lower than 120Hz outside of 4:2:2. So, nothing's really changed for us C7/C8 users, except a much more accurate 23Hz mode

I'm trying to switch from normal HDMI mode, 4:2:2 10-bit at 60Hz, with smooth motion, to PC mode 4:4:4 8-bit, with frame rate switching.

[SamuriHL]

So far I like this new driver a lot. I should grab the studio version just to have it. The improved 23Hz mode is a welcome change. We can thank madshi for pushing them on that one.

[VBB]

Definitely. BTW, now that I'm thinking about using PC mode again, has anyone ever had an issue with the lack of 5:5 pull down, since Real Cinema is permanently OFF?

[SamuriHL]

I use real cinema always so I can't tell you on that one. But that could be a real problem.

[jmone]

Here an update on my testing with the new nVidia drivers after a couple of hours playing a movie. I was hoping for no frame repeats/drops @ 23.976 (4K) out of the box with no tweaks... close but no cigar. Also the Refresh Rates move around a little over the playback period.
- 23.97525 to 23.97434 : 1660Ti to a Sony OLED - 2 Dropped Frame in 2hrs of playback (Decoding Audio)
- 23.97531 to 23.97536 : 1660Ti to a Sony OLED - 1 Repeated Frame in 2hrs of playback (Decoding Audio and Running JRivers "Video Clock")
- 23.97452 to 23.97458 : 1660Ti to a JVC PJ - 2 Dropped Frames in 2hrs of playback (Bitstreaming Audio)

My conclusions so far are:
- Out of the box: The drivers seem to adjust the Refresh Rate during playback to try to avoid Repeated/Dropped frames and it works pretty well... or is it just clock Drift? Anyway, the good news is that over the length of a 2hr movie I get 2 Dropped Frames on a couple of different setups.
- JRiver Video Clock: When I played a movie also using JRivers "Video Clock" (similar to Reclock), I then got 1 Repeated Frame. I don't know if they are "fighting" each other but historically, Video Clock would give me 0 Dropped/Repeated frames on my OLED Setup. Maybe JRiver Video Clock needs a tweak to work a bit better with this new driver???
- madVR Custom Modes: Can't save any custom modes anymore to tweak the refresh rate which previously also got me to 0 Dropped / Repeated frames (on my Bitstreaming PJ setup).

So it is a big improvement but for the perfectionist..... still a bit to do (I guess I'll have to look at CRU unless others have suggestions???)