Evaluation of HEVC decoders (SW, Hybrid and HW) - Page 107

nevcairiel · 1st November 2017, 13:35

Memory bandwidth hasn't really increased much over the last generations, consumer CPUs are still dual channel and the iGPU still uses that same system memory. At the same time 4K 10-bit 60fps uses around 20 times the raw memory bandwidth that your typical 1080p24 content would use.
On the other hand, running copy-back from an NVIDIA card and uploading back to that same NVIDIA card is still quite fast, even with 4K 10-bit content. So one can only conclude that the Intel GPUs are just not very good at this.

huhn · 1st November 2017, 13:36

it's not easy to measure i personally never noticed anything worthwhile using CP with any of my video cards.

native is disabling a lot of possibilities which should not be generally ignored.

aufkrawall · 1st November 2017, 13:37

Just look at the GPU usage reported by tools, it's very noticeable here with GTX 1070 and not too expensive scaling/processing in madVR/mpv.

huhn · 1st November 2017, 13:38

you know my reports it's meaningless on all my cards in the past 4 years.

darkrenata · 2nd November 2017, 00:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by aufkrawall

Just install the latest nightly build and select D3D11 in the video decoder settings instead of DXVA2.
DXVA2 is slower on the GPU than D3D11VA, perhaps this is also true in your case when using copyback. Doesn't hurt trying.

I tried this. Happy to report that for the 4k 60FPS content I have it playbacks flawlessly on my 1080p monitor out of my 970 decoding on the i7-8700k iGPU. I'll try my 4K display next time I turn it on but this seems pretty good so far.

Thanks for the suggestion.

gagmani · 11th November 2017, 04:38

1070 Ti does not have VP9 Profile 2 just like 1070 and 1080.

https://imgur.com/a/4b4c8

Razoola · 11th November 2017, 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by gagmani

1070 Ti does not have VP9 Profile 2 just like 1070 and 1080.

https://imgur.com/a/4b4c8

I was thinking of getting a 1070TI, what does the loss of VP9 profile 2 mean in real terms? Does any nvidia GFX card have it?

huhn · 11th November 2017, 20:02

you can't decode VP9 profile which is used on youtube HDR.
1050 ti and slower 10xx cards and there are information that state the 1080 ti can do it too

gagmani · 12th November 2017, 06:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razoola

I was thinking of getting a 1070TI, what does the loss of VP9 profile 2 mean in real terms? Does any nvidia GFX card have it?

99% youtube vp9 videos would play fine. Only 10 bit(HDR) ones would fail. Netflix playback can be problematic on HDR content.

el Filou · 12th November 2017, 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by gagmani

99% youtube vp9 videos would play fine. Only 10 bit(HDR) ones would fail. Netflix playback can be problematic on HDR content.

Netflix also supports HEVC so that's not a problem.
If Razoola has a powerful CPU maybe they could decode VP9 profile 2 in software?

aufkrawall · 12th November 2017, 15:40

Bitrate of YT VP9 10 bit is lower than of 8 bit, so it might work with software decoding.

Razoola · 12th November 2017, 22:30

I have an old i7 920 at 4Ghz and its not fast enough hence I'm looking for a new gfx card. Can the 950 do it? I understand this card has some HEVC and VP9 support but I'm not sure that includes 10bit.

huhn · 12th November 2017, 22:38

as far as i remember the first card with support is the 1050 ti.

sneaker_ger · 12th November 2017, 22:39

Yes, GTX 950 does HEVC 8 bit + 10 bit and VP9 8 bit but not VP9 10 bit.

Note: AFAIK it does not have the DRM features the Pascal series has. So don't expect 4K Netflix or Blu-ray to work through non-pirate/non-ripped means. I also don't know about HDR even if pirated. Power and RAM are also limited in case you want any advanced madvr features or similar.

nevcairiel · 15th November 2017, 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by huhn

there are information that state the 1080 ti can do it too

I can confirm this, the 1080Ti indeed has VP9 10-bit support.

aufkrawall · 15th November 2017, 19:58

Too bad your VP9 10 bit HW decoding patches haven't got mainlined yet in ffmpeg.

nevcairiel · 15th November 2017, 23:12

Thats because they're not actually complete. LAV uses a bunch of its own HW functions, so it wasn't really required to add the extra stuff. But maybe I should.

Razoola · 17th November 2017, 12:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by nevcairiel

I can confirm this, the 1080Ti indeed has VP9 10-bit support.

I'm a little confused now. So the 1080TI has VP9 10 bit support but the 1080 and 1070TI does not? I somehow got the impression these used the same GPU so I though they would all have the same HW decoding spec.

nevcairiel · 17th November 2017, 13:18

Indeed, the underlying chip variant is what matters, and only GP102 and GP107/108 seem to support it, since both are relatively new. So that is 1080Ti (and possibly the Titan Xp) based on GP102, and the 1050 Ti and below on GP107 or 108.
The 1070 Ti, while a "new" card, is based on the exact same chip as the 1080 and 1070.

Razoola · 17th November 2017, 13:33

Thanks for the clarification.

1st November 2017, 13:35	#2121 \| Link
nevcairiel Registered Developer Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Hamburg/Germany Posts: 10,346	Memory bandwidth hasn't really increased much over the last generations, consumer CPUs are still dual channel and the iGPU still uses that same system memory. At the same time 4K 10-bit 60fps uses around 20 times the raw memory bandwidth that your typical 1080p24 content would use. On the other hand, running copy-back from an NVIDIA card and uploading back to that same NVIDIA card is still quite fast, even with 4K 10-bit content. So one can only conclude that the Intel GPUs are just not very good at this. __________________ LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders

11th November 2017, 04:38	#2126 \| Link
gagmani Registered User Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 8	1070 Ti does not have VP9 Profile 2 just like 1070 and 1080. https://imgur.com/a/4b4c8 Attached Images Last edited by gagmani; 11th November 2017 at 13:48.

15th November 2017, 23:12	#2137 \| Link
nevcairiel Registered Developer Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Hamburg/Germany Posts: 10,346	Thats because they're not actually complete. LAV uses a bunch of its own HW functions, so it wasn't really required to add the extra stuff. But maybe I should. __________________ LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders

17th November 2017, 13:18	#2139 \| Link
nevcairiel Registered Developer Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Hamburg/Germany Posts: 10,346	Indeed, the underlying chip variant is what matters, and only GP102 and GP107/108 seem to support it, since both are relatively new. So that is 1080Ti (and possibly the Titan Xp) based on GP102, and the 1050 Ti and below on GP107 or 108. The 1070 Ti, while a "new" card, is based on the exact same chip as the 1080 and 1070. __________________ LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders

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1st November 2017, 13:36	#2122 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 7,921	it's not easy to measure i personally never noticed anything worthwhile using CP with any of my video cards. native is disabling a lot of possibilities which should not be generally ignored.

1st November 2017, 13:37	#2123 \| Link
aufkrawall Registered User Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 1,812	Just look at the GPU usage reported by tools, it's very noticeable here with GTX 1070 and not too expensive scaling/processing in madVR/mpv.

1st November 2017, 13:38	#2124 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 7,921	you know my reports it's meaningless on all my cards in the past 4 years.

11th November 2017, 20:02	#2128 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 7,921	you can't decode VP9 profile which is used on youtube HDR. 1050 ti and slower 10xx cards and there are information that state the 1080 ti can do it too

12th November 2017, 15:40	#2131 \| Link
aufkrawall Registered User Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 1,812	Bitrate of YT VP9 10 bit is lower than of 8 bit, so it might work with software decoding.

12th November 2017, 22:30	#2132 \| Link
Razoola Registered User Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 454	I have an old i7 920 at 4Ghz and its not fast enough hence I'm looking for a new gfx card. Can the 950 do it? I understand this card has some HEVC and VP9 support but I'm not sure that includes 10bit.

12th November 2017, 22:38	#2133 \| Link
huhn Registered User Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 7,921	as far as i remember the first card with support is the 1050 ti.

12th November 2017, 22:39	#2134 \| Link
sneaker_ger Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 5,565	Yes, GTX 950 does HEVC 8 bit + 10 bit and VP9 8 bit but not VP9 10 bit. Note: AFAIK it does not have the DRM features the Pascal series has. So don't expect 4K Netflix or Blu-ray to work through non-pirate/non-ripped means. I also don't know about HDR even if pirated. Power and RAM are also limited in case you want any advanced madvr features or similar.

15th November 2017, 19:58	#2136 \| Link
aufkrawall Registered User Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 1,812	Too bad your VP9 10 bit HW decoding patches haven't got mainlined yet in ffmpeg.

17th November 2017, 13:33	#2140 \| Link
Razoola Registered User Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 454	Thanks for the clarification.