Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion.

Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules.

 

Go Back   Doom9's Forum > Hardware & Software > Software players

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 30th December 2019, 11:27   #1  |  Link
ace
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 7
What renderer does Windows 10's Movies & TV player use? Plays 10-bit videos great

My 4K UHD TV does not support HDR.

When I use PotPlayer with MadVR to play 10-bit 4K UHD mkv videos, there's significant banding and color problems. Here's an example:



When I play the same file with Windows 10's Movies & TV player it looks perfect to my eyes:



Here are my settings in MadVR:



How do I get it to look "perfect" like in Windows 10 Movies & TV? Is there any way for PotPlayer to use the same renderer as Movies & TV, at least for 10-bit videos?
ace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2019, 11:41   #2  |  Link
Aleksoid1978
Registered User
 
Aleksoid1978's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Russia, Vladivostok
Posts: 2,783
Windows 10's Movies & TV player use DX11 Video Renderer and HDR->SDR conversion by the video driver.
__________________
AMD Ryzen 5 3600 /GIGABYTE B450 Gaming X /Patriot 32Gb@3200 /Kingston 500Gb M.2 /RTX 4060 /Samsung U28R550UQI /OLED Philips 55OLED707 /Yamaha RX-V471 + NS-555 + NS-C444 + NS-333 + YST-SW215
Aleksoid1978 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2019, 12:14   #3  |  Link
huhn
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,903
that should be another case of DXVA2 decoding disable it and try again.
huhn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th December 2019, 13:27   #4  |  Link
Klaus1189
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Bavaria
Posts: 1,666
Out of curiosity, what 4K TV are you using?
Klaus1189 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st December 2019, 18:19   #5  |  Link
ace
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksoid1978 View Post
Windows 10's Movies & TV player use DX11 Video Renderer and HDR->SDR conversion by the video driver.
I see. When I select "Built-in Direct3D 11 Video Renderer" in PotPlayer the HDR->SDR conversion is all messed up (severe banding and color artifacts), just like my MadVR screenshot above. Is it possible to use the video driver's HDR->SDR conversion in PotPlayer also?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaus1189 View Post
Out of curiosity, what 4K TV are you using?
My TV is the LG 84LM9600, which happens to be one of the earliest 4K TVs ever sold. I have the HDMI 2.0/4K60P upgrade installed.
ace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd January 2020, 18:38   #6  |  Link
ace
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 7
My problem was indeed due to DXVA2 decoding as huhn suggested. All good now
ace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th April 2023, 04:38   #7  |  Link
v0lt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by ace View Post
I see. When I select "Built-in Direct3D 11 Video Renderer" in PotPlayer the HDR->SDR conversion is all messed up (severe banding and color artifacts), just like my MadVR screenshot above.
PotPlayer has a different implementation of "Direct3D 11 Video Renderer".
v0lt is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11th April 2023, 09:54   #8  |  Link
clsid
*****
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,642
Edit:

@v0lt
I found this:
https://github.com/Microsoft/DirectX...MapPostProcess
Could be used to get better quality tonemapping with D3D11 in MPCVR?
__________________
MPC-HC 2.1.7.2

Last edited by clsid; 11th April 2023 at 10:50.
clsid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th April 2023, 14:17   #9  |  Link
huhn
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,903
the problem is improving worth it right now?
the current solution is fast and simply aims at bt 709 with a fixed brightness and that's fine it's easy to use.
but if you want more you would start with brightness, gamut and gamma which you currently can't control in mpcVR. and that's a lot of work...

the microsoft stuff doesn't seem to be able to aim at BT 709 but everything else even from BT 709.

for transfer it has linear(what ever that means), SRGB and ST2084 where it talks about color primary where it would force bt 2020 gamut too.
huhn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th October 2023, 12:08   #10  |  Link
Younger
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2023
Posts: 1
It's funny how Windows 10's native Movies & TV player often gets overlooked but can actually perform quite well in specific scenarios like this one. It could be that the native app uses some proprietary rendering techniques that are optimized specifically for Windows 10.
However, it's worth diving into PotPlayer's settings and tweaking some of the rendering options. You may get close to what you're experiencing in the native app.

Last edited by tebasuna51; 10th November 2023 at 13:39. Reason: spam
Younger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th October 2023, 23:10   #11  |  Link
huhn
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,903
can performance quite well by not using a buggy decoder API?
or better said buggy GPU driver.

this is 4 years old and just yet another DXVA2 bug nothing else.
huhn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2023, 14:50   #12  |  Link
butterw2
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 303
Upscaling with Windows 10's Movies & TV player is broken on my system, seems to be using nearest neighbor (fast but very ugly)...

I would add that the UI is rubbish, the feature set is non-existent, and the updates via Windows store are awful.
butterw2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 15:04.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.