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Old 11th July 2020, 18:19   #1  |  Link
blackdark
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encoding setting for tv-series

Hi guyus
I need some advice for encoding tv series 1080p and 720p, i read the x265 documentation but for tv series what are you recommend me about the aq-mode, open-gop, -me, -subme, -tune ssim or not, -preset??? please.
My laptop : Asus ROG STRIX, RTX 2060, 16go RAM, I7-9750H
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Old 11th July 2020, 20:08   #2  |  Link
benwaggoner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackdark View Post
Hi guyus
I need some advice for encoding tv series 1080p and 720p, i read the x265 documentation but for tv series what are you recommend me about the aq-mode, open-gop, -me, -subme, -tune ssim or not, -preset??? please.
My laptop : Asus ROG STRIX, RTX 2060, 16go RAM, I7-9750H
It can vary based on kind of TV series. But TV and movies are pretty much the same within a content type.

Just start with --preset slower, and then pick a faster preset until you get fast enough. Tweaking most of the other stuff is more context specific.

Well, it's probably safe to include these recent parameters that haven't been added to the presets yet
  • --hme
  • --frame-dup
  • --hist-scenecut
  • --scenecut-aware-qp
  • --fades
  • --selective-sao 2
But those aren't going to be close to a night-and-day difference.

Preprocessing correctly if the source is interlaced is going to be a way bigger factor in final quality than anything above.
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Old 12th July 2020, 18:14   #3  |  Link
RanmaCanada
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I would not recommend encoding on a laptop if you value the life of it.
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Old 12th July 2020, 18:56   #4  |  Link
blackdark
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benwaggoner View Post
It can vary based on kind of TV series. But TV and movies are pretty much the same within a content type.

Just start with --preset slower, and then pick a faster preset until you get fast enough. Tweaking most of the other stuff is more context specific.

Well, it's probably safe to include these recent parameters that haven't been added to the presets yet
  • --hme
  • --frame-dup
  • --hist-scenecut
  • --scenecut-aware-qp
  • --fades
  • --selective-sao 2
But those aren't going to be close to a night-and-day difference.

Preprocessing correctly if the source is interlaced is going to be a way bigger factor in final quality than anything above.
Okay, thanks you and for a tv serie video bitrate with around 1500 kb/s what --crf you recommend me??
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Old 12th July 2020, 19:24   #5  |  Link
blackdark
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I would not recommend encoding on a laptop if you value the life of it.
I didnt know, i dont have a computer just a laptop i'm not often at home because of my job i travel with my laptop and about 3 portable external hard drive (5 to; 5 to and 4 to) a lot tv series i'm french and all tv series i found are not encoding
Maybe in the future i will buy a computer
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Old 12th July 2020, 20:05   #6  |  Link
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The concern is more about long term temperatures, if your laptop is not really hot while encoding it is probably fine.

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Originally Posted by blackdark View Post
Okay, thanks you and for a tv serie video bitrate with around 1500 kb/s what --crf you recommend me??
Picking a single CRF to give around 1500 kb/s is impossible. The average bitrate can change really a lot with different sources. For example twice the size or more is common when comparing a grainy/noisy source to a clean one at the same CRF value, and a lot more is not unheard of. 21 or 22 is probably a good starting point but it is so source dependent that could be way off too.

Instead of worrying about the average bitrate it would be better to pick the highest CRF that gives a quality you like.

CRF is great but with fast first pass using two pass encoding is a pretty minor performance hit and is the best option if you have storage constraints or simply want each show to be a similar size.
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Old 12th July 2020, 22:31   #7  |  Link
benwaggoner
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Okay, thanks you and for a tv serie video bitrate with around 1500 kb/s what --crf you recommend me??
It depends a whole lot on the content of the TV show, its frame size, and its frame reate. Even within 1080p25, a high action show with grain may take >3x more bitrate than some simple, clean animation.

Your choice boils down to controlling bitrate and letting quality vary, or controlling quality and letting bitrate vary.

Like lots of "what's the best way..." question the answer is really dependant of the specifics of what you are trying to accomplish.

Also, given you are on a laptop, the right balance between bitrate and encoding speed also will matter. How many minutes of encoding per hour do you need to achieve to justify how much reduction in bitrate?

If your encoding project is optimally successful, what are the parameters of that success?
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Old Yesterday, 09:23   #8  |  Link
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I would not recommend encoding on a laptop if you value the life of it.
True.
Most laptops overheat quickly.

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Originally Posted by blackdark View Post
i'm not often at home because of my job i travel with my laptop
That's pretty much the reason why I've got a laptop in 2016 after spending years on Desktop computers (1998-2015). The thing is that if you really wanna encode with it, download something to tweak your frequencies, turn off the "turbo boost" and also downclock the CPU a little bit, this way it will automatically decrease the VCore and therefore less current will pass and the CPU will heat less and you're probably gonna be fine.
For instance, although I try to encode on a Xeon with a Desktop all the time, when I'm with my laptop (which has an i7 6700HQ), I turn the fan to the maximum speed, I downclock it from 2.60GHz to 1.66GHz and then I let it encode. Temperatures are fine in the 50-58C range. Sure, it takes forever to encode in H.265 (about a week for 24 min in 4K 23.976p 10bit) but it's worth it 'cause if I leave it the way it is, at 3.50GHz turbo boost, it quickly gets to 95 and then gets throttled 'till it goes to 88 and then it goes back to 95 on all cores. It doesn't matter if you change thermal compound with the artic cooler one, put 4 additional fan underneath the case and another 5000 RPM fan on the side to extract hot air, it will always still overheat unless you downclock (and downvolt) it. Honestly, I don't know what laptop manufacturers have in mind, but clearly they seem to gamble on the fact that "people will never use the CPU at 100%, they'll probably just go to twitter, facebook, instagram and outlook" and they just don't care about stress tests...


So in a nutshell: yes, you can encode on a laptop, provided that you downclock/downvolt it and you keep temperatures under control with software like Speccy (if you're on Windows) or lm_sensors (if you're on Linux).

Last edited by FranceBB; Yesterday at 09:26.
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Old Yesterday, 12:49   #9  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benwaggoner View Post
It can vary based on kind of TV series. But TV and movies are pretty much the same within a content type.

Just start with --preset slower, and then pick a faster preset until you get fast enough. Tweaking most of the other stuff is more context specific.

Well, it's probably safe to include these recent parameters that haven't been added to the presets yet
  • --hme
  • --frame-dup
  • --hist-scenecut
  • --scenecut-aware-qp
  • --fades
  • --selective-sao 2
But those aren't going to be close to a night-and-day difference.

Preprocessing correctly if the source is interlaced is going to be a way bigger factor in final quality than anything above.
I would be quite wary adding those just like that. Maybe --hme if the resolution is UHD but not for HD. --selective-sao possibly for low bitrate encodes. The rest I would leave out. --hist-scenecut is a promising idea but it seems to be broken.
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Old Yesterday, 13:26   #10  |  Link
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To expand on Benwaggoner answer. I would start by deciding on the timeframe of encoding, how much time are you willing to spend on the entire project. Then spend 10-20% of this time on testing the encoders with 30-60s sample to select "the best" codec at proper preset(crf or 2-pass+speed preset+resolution) to match intended encoding speed. I would suggest testing x264, x265, and nvenc because the encoding speed is a significant consideration. If the video has grain use denoiser. At 1500kbps 1080p may be bit-starved, so probably 720p would be better. Then eventually spend 5-10% of the time on fine-tuning, but I doubt it will make a big difference.

There's no universal solution. Each video is different and compressibility varies. For "the best" results tests and tweaking is necessary.

Regarding laptop longevity... I think it's broscience. I'm no professional and it's only anectodal evidence, but I am killing 4200H for 6 years(probably like half a year of constant worktime) running it at 95C and it still works. While there exists solid theory behind reducing longevity by high temperatures, there's no actual data. Besides, I would be much more afraid of stresses caused by temperature gradient rather than by constant high temperature.

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Originally Posted by FranceBB View Post
it will always still overheat unless you downclock (and downvolt) it. Honestly, I don't know what laptop manufacturers have in mind, but clearly they seem to gamble on the fact that "people will never use the CPU at 100%, they'll probably just go to twitter, facebook, instagram and outlook" and they just don't care about stress tests...


So in a nutshell: yes, you can encode on a laptop, provided that you downclock/downvolt it and you keep temperatures under control with software like Speccy (if you're on Windows) or lm_sensors (if you're on Linux).
Have you thought that the "overheating" may occur above the throttling limit(95C+)? Maybe your limit of 58C prolongs the CPU longevity from 7 years to 40 years and frankly, there's no value in doing so? The cooling performance is approximately proportional to temperature difference, so designing a cooling system keeping CPU at 60C would be simply inefficient.

Last edited by alfik0; Yesterday at 13:28.
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Old Yesterday, 15:35   #11  |  Link
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Have you thought that the "overheating" may occur above the throttling limit(95C+)? Maybe your limit of 58C prolongs the CPU longevity from 7 years to 40 years and frankly, there's no value in doing so? The cooling performance is approximately proportional to temperature difference, so designing a cooling system keeping CPU at 60C would be simply inefficient.
Not really, above 95 it will certainly die, that's why they put the throttling limit, however staying at 95 all the time isn't good either. A friend of mine killed a monocore notebook after 27 days straight of HD 4:4:4 10bit encoding in H.264 several years ago. The problem with high temperatures is not the CPU per se, but everything it has around, including the motherboard which may suffer such an high temperature...
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Old Yesterday, 16:26   #12  |  Link
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Not really, above 95 it will certainly die, that's why they put the throttling limit, however staying at 95 all the time isn't good either. A friend of mine killed a monocore notebook after 27 days straight of HD 4:4:4 10bit encoding in H.264 several years ago. The problem with high temperatures is not the CPU per se, but everything it has around, including the motherboard which may suffer such an high temperature...
This. Back in the day we used to see laptops where the air vents had melted because of prolonged high heat. The plastic would also warp around the CPU, and it wasn't uncommon for the keyboard connections to have some damage. I would say since OP's laptop has an nvidia gpu, to just use nvenc instead of x265.
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Old Yesterday, 17:05   #13  |  Link
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Even desktops can get overheated. My newish dual Xeon workstation would sometimes crash under sustained heavy load, particularly when GPU and CPUs were both hitting hard. I needed to increase the minimum fan speed for my overnight renders to reliably complete overnight.

In the end, pretty much everything in computing winds up being heat limited. Pixels-per-picojoule is a metric I've used before in encoding and decoding tuning.
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