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Old 15th December 2016, 23:00   #41521  |  Link
Telion
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madshi, can you please make a small change in switching the debanding on/off by keyboard? I've requested this around a year ago and you've answered that you will take a look at it but it might take some time. So I'm just meekly reminding about it and begging you to implement this during your current work on making the UI a bit more streamlined:
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I usually use either a high debanding or no debanding during several files in a series. If I'd switch through GUI, it's all plain and simple - the radiobutton is always at "high" position and I can just toggle only the checkbox. Obviously I want to speed up things by using keyboard shortcuts, but the different story begins here. For example, I start from debanding at "high" but off and want to turn it on. So I press Ctlr-Alt-Shift-A twice (OSD shows off->high) and then hit F2 to save. Everything goes as expected. Afterwards, I want to switch it back off and repeat the same sequence, OSD showing high->off. But now it turns out that not only the checkbox was toggled - the radiobutton was also set to "low" value, so next time I'd need to press Ctlr-Alt-Shift-A four times, going all the way through off->low->medium->high. I humbly ask you to change this behaviour so that the radiobutton won't get reset from its initial value if the final result of keypresses is "off" at the moment of releasing all keys in the shortcut combination. It's not that I'm too bothered with two extra keypresses - I just want to get used to the same keypress sequence for toggling debanding on and off and pay no attention to its initial state or OSD.
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Old 15th December 2016, 23:16   #41522  |  Link
ryrynz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrik G View Post
Thats useless as it also depends on the display you use.
And they also performs different in motion.
Static screenshots and the image you get when the movie is running is not the same.
Plasma tvs for example has much higher motion resolution than lcds or oleds and so they will show a sharper image.

You are not maximizing madvrs upscaling algorithms on an LCD or OLED lol
300 lines is sub DVD resolution in motion.
Plasma tvs can show all 1080 lines from Blu Ray content
Jesus Christ. By that reasoning we shouldn't be using screenshots at all.. Nothing matters because everyone's display is different. What a load of tripe!

The results are consistent across everyone's display regardless of whether you see a difference or not! The better the display and the better optimised it is the more obvious the changes will be.

Different displays don't invalidate screen shots at all. Might as well tell madshi to stop taking screenshots based on the above nonsense.

Last edited by ryrynz; 16th December 2016 at 00:17.
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Old 15th December 2016, 23:19   #41523  |  Link
Damie
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HEVC 4K, colors off in fullscreen

Hello,

why are the colors blown off (especially blue) in fullscreen with the following HEVC 4K video & MadVR?

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/FsZX/4GqUibRKS (click the title to download the sample video)

I'm using Sony X850C as the display (10bit & HDR & BT.2020 compatible).

edit: It seems that DXVA2 image downscaling is disabled @ windowed mode, so somehow DXVA2 processing & MadVR fails at producing correct colors with this file.
I'm using the latest MadVR & Lav 0.69.0 & MPC-BE 1.5 x86.
The file plays fine using Windows Media Player using the default GPU decoding (GTX 960).

Thanks for any help!

Last edited by Damie; 16th December 2016 at 01:57.
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Old 16th December 2016, 03:35   #41524  |  Link
AngelGraves13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damie View Post
Hello,

why are the colors blown off (especially blue) in fullscreen with the following HEVC 4K video & MadVR?

https://cloud.mail.ru/public/FsZX/4GqUibRKS (click the title to download the sample video)

I'm using Sony X850C as the display (10bit & HDR & BT.2020 compatible).

edit: It seems that DXVA2 image downscaling is disabled @ windowed mode, so somehow DXVA2 processing & MadVR fails at producing correct colors with this file.
I'm using the latest MadVR & Lav 0.69.0 & MPC-BE 1.5 x86.
The file plays fine using Windows Media Player using the default GPU decoding (GTX 960).

Thanks for any help!
DXVA scaling should be avoided. Try using Jinc for everything and report back.
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Old 16th December 2016, 10:37   #41525  |  Link
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trade quality for performance options

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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Those look fine actually, I was hoping NNEDI3 128 would be faster for you but that isn't too far off. I have a Titan X (Pascal), OC 2050 MHz.
@Asmodian (or someone expert), if you are so kind, pls tell me what options you have enabled in "Trade quality for performance".

These are my options. I think I'm missing something...



thks!!!
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Old 16th December 2016, 11:02   #41526  |  Link
fedpul
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Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
@Asmodian (or someone expert), if you are so kind, pls tell me what options you have enabled in "Trade quality for performance".

These are my options. I think I'm missing something...



thks!!!
Hi, for maximum picture quality you should untick everything there.

Enviado desde mi MI 4LTE mediante Tapatalk
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Old 16th December 2016, 11:05   #41527  |  Link
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Quote:
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These are my options. I think I'm missing something...
Missing something??
Nothing you have ticked really changes much of anything, certainly nothing you'd notice unless your using debanding or DXVA even then it's questionable.
If you want full quality like I said only a few pages back, untick the lot that's what most here have done unless they have slow/dated hardware.
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Old 16th December 2016, 11:25   #41528  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fedpul View Post
Hi, for maximum picture quality you should untick everything there.

Enviado desde mi MI 4LTE mediante Tapatalk
Thks, hablas espaņol? Disabling everything, the render time goes up by 3 or 4 ms (29 ms max total render time for 2k to 4k with NGU Very high), it's fine for me.
How do you use it? everything disabled too? My gtx 1080 g1 cries!

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Last edited by Oguignant; 16th December 2016 at 11:28.
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Old 16th December 2016, 12:27   #41529  |  Link
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About dithering

Quick questiin about dithering...

On 10-bit tv screens with full screen D3D11 exclusive mode is better without dithering? Or is it always better to use ordered dithering?
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Old 16th December 2016, 12:35   #41530  |  Link
huhn
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never disable dithering.
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Old 16th December 2016, 12:40   #41531  |  Link
Oguignant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
never disable dithering.
For that reason I ask. I read in a forum that with tv 10-bit panel + d3d11 in fullscreen exclusive mode disable it. What happens if I use it disabled? TV breaks or something?
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Old 16th December 2016, 12:47   #41532  |  Link
huhn
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you are lowering quality.

Quote:
TV breaks or something?
please...
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Old 16th December 2016, 12:47   #41533  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
For that reason I ask. I read in a forum that with tv 10-bit panel + d3d11 in fullscreen exclusive mode disable it. What happens if I use it disabled? TV breaks or something?


If you disable dithering you are losing information like details and color transition... also dithering prevents banding that can happen even in 10bit


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Old 16th December 2016, 12:50   #41534  |  Link
Damie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelGraves13 View Post
DXVA scaling should be avoided. Try using Jinc for everything and report back.
Thanks, unticking "use DXVA chroma upscaling when doing native DXVA decoding" did the trick!
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Old 16th December 2016, 12:50   #41535  |  Link
Oguignant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
you are lowering quality.



please...
Jejeje it's a joke. I activate it again.
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Old 16th December 2016, 15:02   #41536  |  Link
Patrik G
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OK after several days of testing picture quality from Blu Ray content on my KRP-500M i have come to the conclusion that NGU for chroma upscaling goes overboard with sharpness.
Picture is too messy with NGU and the resolution looks reduced.
Back to NNEDI3

i have allways thought that there was too much noise in the picture with madvr compared to regular broadcast but i couldnt figure out what setting it was until some days ago
it seems that i have missed two important settings with "Error Diffusion".
i have allways used Error Diffusion 2 with "use color noise" and "change dither for every frame" as both of them was ticked default.
unticked both of them and there goes the annoying noise that has been in the picture.
if its noise now its only there because the movie has it.

i must say that the picture is so good now with Blu Ray when i have found the right combination of settings that i must rewatch every movie

Final settings of what i think maximizes a 9G Kuro Plasma for 1080P Blu Ray content with madvr.

Chroma upscaling: NNEDI3 128
No SuperRes filter (leave it unticked)

"Image upscaling" is not active here with 1080P content on a 1080P display so it doesnt matter what settings you have there.

Rendering:
Smooth Motion Enable (Allways)

Dithering:
Error Diffusion- Option 2
Untick "use colored noise" and "change dither for every frame"

Thats it
THE cleanest/sharpest and most neutral picture i have ever seen on this tv.

Edit:
9G Kuros with Pure Drive and mostly the KRPs are sharp as hell from start so any other sharpening crap as image enhancements or upscaling refinement isnt needed.
Remember 1080 lines of native motion resolution

Last edited by Patrik G; 16th December 2016 at 15:17.
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Old 16th December 2016, 15:54   #41537  |  Link
BluesFanUK
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NNEDI3 128 is OTT, 64 max. The difference isn't noticeable unless you've got hawk eye vision and eats all the power.
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Old 16th December 2016, 17:54   #41538  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
Disabling everything, the render time goes up by 3 or 4 ms (29 ms max total render time for 2k to 4k with NGU Very high), it's fine for me.
How do you use it? everything disabled too? My gtx 1080 g1 cries!
I run with everything disabled. If you use subtitles enabling "optimize subtitle quality for performance instead of quality" can have a noticeable impact on performance without a significant hit to subtitle quality, but that is the only one I could imagine using with a GTX 1080.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oguignant View Post
Quick questiin about dithering...

On 10-bit tv screens with full screen D3D11 exclusive mode is better without dithering? Or is it always better to use ordered dithering?
I know this was already answered but I will do a little rant here too.
Never disable dithering! Anyone who recommends disabling dithering, when using 10-bit output or not, should then be ignored for all other madVR/video playback advice because they obviously don't know what they are talking about.

As CarlosCaco said you are simply losing information with dithering disabled. Ordered dithering, or even random if you want to eliminate the performance hit as much as possible, but never disabled. Disabled is only for testing.
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Old 16th December 2016, 20:14   #41539  |  Link
Oguignant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
I run with everything disabled. If you use subtitles enabling "optimize subtitle quality for performance instead of quality" can have a noticeable impact on performance without a significant hit to subtitle quality, but that is the only one I could imagine using with a GTX 1080.



I know this was already answered but I will do a little rant here too.
Never disable dithering! Anyone who recommends disabling dithering, when using 10-bit output or not, should then be ignored for all other madVR/video playback advice because they obviously don't know what they are talking about.

As CarlosCaco said you are simply losing information with dithering disabled. Ordered dithering, or even random if you want to eliminate the performance hit as much as possible, but never disabled. Disabled is only for testing.
About dithering: It was pretty clear to me.

I've been trying out various configuration alternatives. With these options I obtained the best results in the image quality. (Definition, noise, sharpness, etc.) Always in 2k to 4k upscaling. (NNEDI 256 neurons is far away for me).
Another question... What is the limit on the best render time? 30, 40 ms...?

Chroma upscaling NGU high
Image upscaling luma NGU very high
Image upscaling chroma NGU very high
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 30 ms

Chroma upscaling NEDDI3 32 neurons
Image upscaling luma doubling NEDDI64 quadupling 32 neurons
Image upscaling chroma very high
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 29 ms

Chroma upscaling NEDDI3 32 neurons
Image upscaling luma doubling NEDDI128 quadupling 32 neurons
Image upscaling chroma very high
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 38 ms (without dropped frames)

Chroma upscaling NEDDI3 32 neurons
Image upscaling luma doubling NEDDI128 quadupling 32 neurons
Image upscaling chroma Let madvr decide
Crop black bars
Without upscaling refinement
Others option let madvr decide
All trade quality for performant option diasabling
Dithrring Error difusion option 1 without user colored noise and change dithering...
Render time 33 ms

Personally, I like it with a touch of enhance detail (1.5) ... but I think they look pretty good as well. What do you think about of these screen shot? Any suggestions?

http://i.imgur.com/mcrqfcT.png
http://i.imgur.com/Uofoc7O.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kZPIthO.png
http://i.imgur.com/USVXgjb.jpg

neddi 128 vs neddi 64 (I do not see much difference)
http://i.imgur.com/PF4gwyx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/9sCgM16.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/tY7BFka.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/nb6dRNr.jpg
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Last edited by Oguignant; 17th December 2016 at 02:44.
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Old 16th December 2016, 22:33   #41540  |  Link
Magik Mark
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Guys,

Is there a way for madvr to run in PLEX?
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