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Old 17th February 2019, 06:05   #23341  |  Link
Mevunky
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Originally Posted by raymondjpg View Post
I think you have a point, but in my system it only works if I configure Intel Display Audio in Windows as stereo. I can then get sound out of the center speaker as well as L and R. However, if I configure it as 5.1 surround then the signal received by the Yamaha is 3/2/0.1 even when the source is stereo PCM, and I hear no sound from the center speaker. I have seen this issue arise with other media players outputting HDMI sound through AV receivers. The receiver is expecting to receive signal from all channels, and does not apply Prologic II.
This makes sense, however I see no reason to set Windows to anything other than stereo mode, for proper surround everything is bitstreamed anyway. I have always set all machines to 2.0 as 99% of generic sound content is 2.0 which keeps everything in check and fixes your PL issues - as for the rest its bitstreamed and bypasses the shared mixer anyways. I personally see no upside in setting Windows to anything other than 2.0.
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Old 17th February 2019, 06:29   #23342  |  Link
raymondjpg
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Originally Posted by Mevunky View Post
This makes sense, however I see no reason to set Windows to anything other than stereo mode, for proper surround everything is bitstreamed anyway. I have always set all machines to 2.0 as 99% of generic sound content is 2.0 which keeps everything in check and fixes your PL issues - as for the rest its bitstreamed and bypasses the shared mixer anyways. I personally see no upside in setting Windows to anything other than 2.0.
I'll certainly try setting Windows to stereo mode, but my priority is to try and work around loss of audio when using MPC-HC and display rate switching with madVR. Otherwise I'm limited to using PotPlayer.

The problem I see with setting to stereo is playing back multi-channel AAC. I haven't found an AV receiver yet that will decode AAC sound so the only option is to decode using LAV audio, ffdshow, or AC3 Filter and (if AC3Filter is set for transcoding PCM to AC3) transcoding on the fly. I don't know how Windows and the receiver would cope with multi-channel PCM, if Windows was set to stereo only mode and AC3 Filter (and/or ffdshow) was disabled.
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Old 17th February 2019, 07:55   #23343  |  Link
raymondjpg
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I had another go at setting MPC-HC 1.8.4 as the external player in Emby Theater, this time with the Exclusive mode checkbox selected under Audio Renderer.

1. With audio output set to Default DirectSound Device, behaviour as before. Sound does not survive madVR refresh rate changing.

2. With audio output set to Internal Audio Renderer, sound does survive madVR refresh rate changing. However, it appears that AC3Filter's automatic association with post-processing MPC-HC sound is lost because stereo PCM (now received at the Yamaha receiver as stereo) was not transcoded to AC3. This would not matter too much if the only PCM we wanted to transcode was stereo. I think it might matter more if we wished to transcode multi-channel PCM.

3. Setting AC3 Filter as a preferred External Filter in MPC-HC, E-AC3 (at least) appeared to be decoded to PCM i.e. no longer bitstreaming as desired.

It may be that I have just not found the correct combination of settings. I may try again, but for now I have returned to PotPlayer and external LAV filters.

Edit: On closer scrutiny, it appears that AC3Filter's automatic association with post-processing MPC-HC sound is NOT lost when audio output set to Internal Audio Renderer, and after madVR refresh rate changing. However, the audio delivered to the AV receiver is PCM sound until video play is stopped then started again. Same with E-AC3. After madVR refresh rate changing, the audio delivered to the AV receiver is PCM sound until video play is stopped then started again.

This is not as bad as no audio after refresh rate changing, but I would still prefer to see the correct audio format delivered to the AV receiver after refresh rate changing.

Last edited by raymondjpg; 17th February 2019 at 08:27. Reason: Updated information
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Old Yesterday, 07:07   #23344  |  Link
Mevunky
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I would look at avoiding multi-channel AAC content entirely? It is not a great way to do surround (hence why many receivers don't support it) this would go a long way to solving some of your problems.

Last edited by Mevunky; Yesterday at 07:28.
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Old Yesterday, 16:50   #23345  |  Link
el Filou
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Why is AAC "not a great way to do surround"? It's certainly higher quality/size than AC3, and fine if you don't use the features associated with Dolby metadata.
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Old Yesterday, 23:57   #23346  |  Link
raymondjpg
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Originally Posted by Mevunky View Post
I would look at avoiding multi-channel AAC content entirely? It is not a great way to do surround (hence why many receivers don't support it) this would go a long way to solving some of your problems.
It's not so much a matter of avoiding multi-channel AAC content as coping with it when it does arise. I acknowledge I do not see many examples of multi-channel AAC content, and it is some time since I last saw one.

I don't know why people use it to code media. It may be because source TV material is multi-channel AAC (probably unlikely because there are no AV receivers available to decode it) or because there is an attempt to maximise compression to keep file size to a minimum. In my neck of the woods we only have stereo TV channels and the tendency is to broadcast AC3 on HD channels, although there is some AAC on SD channels. In the past (some time ago) there was experimentation with multi-channel but IIRC it was AC3 audio.

While AC3 Filter and ffdshow still work in Windows 10 my HTPCs can transcode PCM decoded from all AAC formats by LAV filters, and given that bitstreaming with external LAV filters doesn't work for me in Windows 10, directing AC3Filter to be used for AC3 and DTS, and specifying those formats for bitstreaming in AC3 Filter, overcomes that obstacle.

I'd be more concerned that AC3 Filter and ffdshow might cease to work in future builds of Windows 10. I have no basis for that concern, but neither application has seen any development since 2012.

Last edited by raymondjpg; Yesterday at 23:59.
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