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11th July 2016, 17:23 | #38641 | Link |
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To solidify my statements about ABL and code values, here is an image from the LG_Chess_HDR video:
With HDR OFF, his nose has values of 255 which equate to 10,000 nit but the metadata peaks at 1000 nit. May I suggest a solution, not only complaint. When the measured peak white is below the peak metadata value, the measured luminance value should be stretched like it does now (if I'm not mistaken). But when the measured peak value is higher than the metadata (like this example) the luminance should be given headroom in % (not a free lunch). In other words, give 105% as the new luminance, and super compress anything above metadata into these 5%. Example: If metadata is 1000nit and there is code values above that, compress them to 1050 nit. We lose 5% in average luminance but we do not lose picture information which is way more important. EDIT: If we actually measure the code/bit values, many of the HDR test videos have code values above the peak metadata value, which currently madvr clips above.
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11th July 2016, 20:22 | #38642 | Link | |
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11th July 2016, 21:17 | #38643 | Link |
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OK here goes, please don't shoot, 1080p original Vs SR@2 LL Vs SR@2 LL+AB75%, dithering was disabled:
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178286 http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178284 http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178285 All files can be found here. Long story short edges are less noisy and it looks wonderful with FRC, double SR@2 after every 2X upscale looks seriously edgy otherwise IME. It might also be closer to the ground truth, at least edges would appear to be. Last edited by leeperry; 11th July 2016 at 21:50. |
11th July 2016, 21:49 | #38644 | Link | ||
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And then there's the problem that this kind of thing would require me to piece 3 line/curve segments together, which makes the math quite a bit more complicated. Furthermore, compression already gets much stronger the higher the peak is. In order to compress a large overshoot into just 5% more room would require even stronger compression ratios which I'm not sure would look much different to clipping. Overall I'm not sure it's worth spending lots and lots of development time and effort into a probably very small improvement like this. I'm not even sure there would be a visible benefit at all. I think the main visual problems don't come from luminance overshoots, but from highly saturated pure color highlights, as explained before. Quote:
1) SR@1 with AB25. 2) SR@1 with AB disabled. 3) SR disabled. The purpose is to find out whether maybe activating AB maybe simply just decreases the effect/strength of SR without having any other benefit. Thanks. |
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11th July 2016, 22:20 | #38645 | Link | |
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http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178293 http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178295 http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178298 files on mega I got a good bunch of other features enabled in the upscaling refinement window, my point was in my real-world use AB75 does wonders. Of course SR looks sharper than without but I believe the top left of the picture in my first link with SR1 looks better with AB25 than without. The whole point of AB to me is that motion looks smoother because edges aren't nearly as noisy anymore. Anyway, please bring it back |
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11th July 2016, 22:41 | #38646 | Link | |
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no HDR processing |
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12th July 2016, 04:22 | #38647 | Link |
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This is my previously posted comparison of SuperRes with and without anti-bloating:
I have a couple of examples of where anti-bloating removes detail that would be considered valid sharpening. SD -> FHD super-xbr100 + SuperRes (3) In the first example, search for the headline "Rick Nielsen: no cheap collector" in the middle of the image. SuperRes does a good job of making the original letters more clear and easy to read. While anti-bloating returns these letters to a blurred smear. The rest of the lettering, especially on the lower part of the guitar shows the same improvement and then degradation when anti-bloating is enabled. Guitar Guitar SuperRes (3) Guitar SuperRes (3) + Anti-Bloating 100% In the second example, look at the leather patches on Kata Mara's arm and the black guy. Also, the objects in the shadows (top-right) become obscured when anti-bloating is enabled. SuperRes again slightly enhances the low-res original and anti-bloating effectively cancels this out. Fantastic Four Fantastic Four SuperRes (3) Fantastic Four SuperRes (3) + Anti-Bloating 100% So far, only my original test where SuperRes (3) was combined with crispen edges (1.0) did anti-bloating prove to be an effective countermeasure for SuperRes. I am thankful to see that SuperRes, at the right strength, does not oversharpen the image. This has completely changed my settings preferences.
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12th July 2016, 04:58 | #38648 | Link | ||
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Yet again, we must remember that the code values control the LED backlight, and the code value do NOT actually clip if the the backlight can't go brighter. Lets just hope no colorist relies on that trait of current HDR TVs/mastering Monitors because in the future a TV might just show these 10,000 nit peaks and look blindingly bright in the wrong spots. In my example with the nose and zoyds example with the chess piece the peak brightness is 10,000 nit in some places while the peak metadata is 1000 nit. We should never see a chess piece or a human nose radiating as bright as the sun... so this LG_Chess video has some "noob" flaws in terms of HDR encoding. I may be completely wrong and the camera actually captured 10,000 nit from the boom lights illuminating the scene and reflecting from shiny objects. So the colorist actually did an excellent job preserving that in the encoding even though the final video was mastered for/on a 1000nit peak display.
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12th July 2016, 05:24 | #38649 | Link |
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madshi,
What changes happened between 0.90.20 and 0.90.22 that would hurt performance? As I have said in the past, I like pushing my GPU to the max and my 720p24 profile is right on the edge (so much so that even a chroma superres of just 1 pushes it over the edge). When I tried 0.90.22 the first file I watched at 720p was actually 718 and I thought the performance hit was because of that... however later I watched one that was 720 and I could no longer maintain render queue. I rolled back to 0.90.20 and all is well again. Just curious what could have changed since I didn't see anything is the changelog for either 21 or 22. Something deeper under the hood? QB
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12th July 2016, 05:33 | #38650 | Link |
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Hi,
What does it mean if 1080p/720p MKV movies have present queue 0-2/3 in Windowed Mode but FSE it works fine. Asus G751JT Windows 8.1 x64 + Potplayer x64 + Lavfilters 0.61 + DXVA2 CopyBack or CUVID + 970M + 368.69 Drivers + Potplayer Profile set to Maximum Performance - 3 Pre-rendered frames - Gsync Disabled Fixed Refresh How can I fix it ? |
12th July 2016, 07:17 | #38651 | Link | |
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Anyway, it's not like anyone is forcing you to run AB on SR and I kinda rest my case that the top left corner with sxbr75+SR1 looks better with AB25 than without: http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/178293 This is what AB does, it cleans edges for smoother movements. Either way there is no free lunch to be expected from upscaling, it's all about compromises and I find the AB75% compromise more than worth it as picture doesn't look harsh and oversharpened anymore. Last edited by leeperry; 12th July 2016 at 07:34. |
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12th July 2016, 07:51 | #38652 | Link | ||
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12th July 2016, 11:27 | #38655 | Link | |
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12th July 2016, 13:43 | #38657 | Link |
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what image/chroma upscaling, and refinement settings would you guys suggest, if you got enough gpu power (GTX 1080)?
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12th July 2016, 14:25 | #38659 | Link | |
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12th July 2016, 14:27 | #38660 | Link | |
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For chroma I yould suggest NNEDI32, and Luma image doubling at 64 neurons. But I would like to know is, what settings the other guys here prefer when using NNEDI or superXBR. Are you using SR with both? Any other suggestions?
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling |
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