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Old 22nd January 2014, 21:57   #21561  |  Link
vivan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6233638 View Post
It would probably be faster to go from 720p > 1080p with nnedi3 directly, than 720p > 1440p (nnedi3) > 1080p (catmull-rom)
but nnedi3 can upscale only by factor of 2x. Or not?
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Old 22nd January 2014, 23:04   #21562  |  Link
truexfan81
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but nnedi3 can upscale only by factor of 2x. Or not?
nnedi3 only upscales by powers of 2 (ie, 2x, 4x, 8x...).
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Old 22nd January 2014, 23:37   #21563  |  Link
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Oh - I was not aware of that. I assumed it was a performance-saving feature, not a requirement.
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Old 22nd January 2014, 23:52   #21564  |  Link
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yeah so people with weird sized videos, your downscale setting will be more important as it will actually get used
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Old 23rd January 2014, 00:24   #21565  |  Link
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Originally Posted by 6233638 View Post
1080p (catmull-rom)
Why would you prefer catmull-rom over some of the other downscaling options?
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Old 23rd January 2014, 01:37   #21566  |  Link
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Because it's the best. Just read the thread, everything has been said already.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 01:42   #21567  |  Link
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Because it's the best. Just read the thread, everything has been said already.
That's not what I've read elsewhere. And with 21k posts it's not a very realistic option to read the whole thread.

Last edited by Stereodude; 23rd January 2014 at 01:45.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 03:00   #21568  |  Link
kasper93
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So to make it clear. You want me to search the thread for you because you're too lazy, or what? Just search for "Catmull-Rom" and you will get all related posts. CR with AR and Linear Light enabled produce the most accurate and natural looking picture. I tested it a lot myself and I like CR best. Here is comparison to Lanczos done by @6233638 http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?p=1606829&postcount=16482

And remember that there is no best option, some people like sharp image with aliasing, some like softer image but without artifacts. You need to compare results yourself, it's not that hard.

Last edited by kasper93; 23rd January 2014 at 03:03.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 03:01   #21569  |  Link
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speaking of upscaling by powers of 2..

Has anyone cared about upscaling 1080p video(or film) to UHD (2160p) and downscaling back to monitor resolution (1080p)?

Visual difference I found were CGs (pixelated fonts etc) blending
in with rest of the picture although seeming a bit blurry (probably
due to outlines being blended with adjacent pixels).
More importantly, digital noises seemed less intrusive to my eyes.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 03:01   #21570  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6233638 View Post
However, it might be possible for them to use nnedi3 to scale 2x (which should be faster) and then use another algorithm to scale the resulting image to your display resolution, while still benefiting from some of nnedi3's quality improvements.
Nnedi3 can only do 2x enlargement - it isn't a scaler, but interpolator (hence why it is used for deinterlacing and anti-aliasing). All it can do is interpolate an image into a double-height version. If you stack that two times (once for reach dimension), you will get a 2x upscaled image.

So to do general rescaling with it, you need to combine it with a conventional resampler that will change the resolution to desired values.

For example, if you have 640x360 source, nnedi3 can only give you these sizes: 640x720, 1280x360, 1280x720, 2560x720, 1280x1440, 2560x1440 ...

Also since nnedi3 is a (complex) interpolator, not a scaler, it can lead to various sorts of artifacts, since basically, the filter is "guessing" what is in the extra pixels. It can make mistakes, like blurring/connecting adjacent sharp lines for example.

Last edited by mandarinka; 23rd January 2014 at 03:04.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 06:28   #21571  |  Link
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Originally Posted by truexfan81 View Post
nnedi3 only upscales by powers of 2 (ie, 2x, 4x, 8x...).
so if I wanna upscale a 4:3 360*288 video to 1080p, I want it to be 1440*1080 in the end so ideally I would like to go 4X360 + 2X288? Apparently mVR will only do 2X

Quote:
Originally Posted by drew_afx View Post
Has anyone cared about upscaling 1080p video(or film) to UHD (2160p) and downscaling back to monitor resolution (1080p)?

Visual difference I found were CGs (pixelated fonts etc) blending
in with rest of the picture although seeming a bit blurry (probably
due to outlines being blended with adjacent pixels).
More importantly, digital noises seemed less intrusive to my eyes.
The Avisynth ppl call it SuperSampling, it's like processing audio in 48int/64fp and then dithering back to 24int.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 07:34   #21572  |  Link
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so if I wanna upscale a 4:3 360*288 video to 1080p, I want it to be 1440*1080 in the end so ideally I would like to go 4X360 + 2X288? Apparently mVR will only do 2X
do you really think that matter with a 288 p. 2x is all what is needed for most video
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Old 23rd January 2014, 08:47   #21573  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drew_afx View Post
Has anyone cared about upscaling 1080p video(or film) to UHD (2160p) and downscaling back to monitor resolution (1080p)?

Visual difference I found were CGs (pixelated fonts etc)
This is the one and only reason you should ever do this. (Similarly, watching cheaply made aliased junk like YuGiOh.) Anti-aliasing is one of the primary purposes of EDI, but it's much faster to use regular denoising shaders or filters if you don't have extreme aliasing. At that resolution, anti-aliasing would probably not be realtime, anyway; you'd have to re-encode, and you could manually do just the subtitles.

With any luck XySubFilter will eventually do anti-aliasing for VobSub and PGS, so there's no need to do it on the full screen. I feel your pain!

Quote:
Originally Posted by leeperry View Post
so if I wanna upscale a 4:3 360*288 video to 1080p, I want it to be 1440*1080 in the end so ideally I would like to go 4X360 + 2X288? Apparently mVR will only do 2X
Garbage in, garbage out. It'll look different, but it'll never look good. Just stick with one iteration+jinc.

(If you have a cartoony palette with lots of aliasing though, hq4x or double nnedi might be useful. But rarely for natural video.)
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Old 23rd January 2014, 08:49   #21574  |  Link
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How about Nnedi de-interlacing? I suppose Nnedi can provide better results than motion/vector adaptive?
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Old 23rd January 2014, 08:54   #21575  |  Link
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but field matching is way better and 60fps bob with nnedi is pretty unrealistic
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Old 23rd January 2014, 09:02   #21576  |  Link
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For video mode deinterlacing madVR will continue to rely on DXVA for the near future. At some point (not soon) I'm going to look into the whole deinterlacing topic again. But for now no changes in that area. FWIW, motion adaptive video mode deinterlacing (= weaving for static image areas) and something like nnedi3 are not mutually exclusive.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 10:34   #21577  |  Link
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How will an HD picture look upscaled to 2560x1440?

Any sharpness loss?
Anyone directly compared between the two (side by side)?

Last edited by James Freeman; 23rd January 2014 at 13:04.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 10:58   #21578  |  Link
huhn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Freeman View Post
How will an HD picture look upscaled to 2560x1440?

Any sharpness loss?
Anyone directly compared between the two (side by side)?
just try it out with the avisynth script
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Old 23rd January 2014, 14:13   #21579  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James Freeman View Post
Any sharpness loss?
Before asking questions about "sharpness" again, understand what it means.

I am not a big fan of the Gibbs phenomenon caused by bicubic, Lanczos, or similar "sharp" interpolations.
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Old 23rd January 2014, 14:18   #21580  |  Link
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DxVA2 Scaler seems not working in full screen mode with 1080p videoes.
Demo mode (it can be enabled in CCC) does not work in full screen.
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling

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