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11th May 2015, 12:50 | #2081 | Link | ||
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This part of the comment was about the claim of Zachs you use some of the Shader code of MPC-HC, if it's the case, the GPL license propagate to MadVr if you don't have the same kind of permission you got from tritical. (some light of the GPLv3 : http://blog.milkingthegnu.org/2008/0...r-dummies.html) In the case you said with EVR, since EVR is a system lib, no problem else ... it's tricky again ... GPL is really more an ideal than anything else ... and if I'm right, haven't been tested in court either. Anyway, for that nevcairiel cleared up the question, and well the API is provided by the system. Yeap, I just meant, the agreement you did before with madvr was already enough |
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11th May 2015, 13:00 | #2082 | Link |
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I'm not directly using any MPC-HC shader code in madVR. What Zachs meant is that users can setup MPC-HC to send shader code to madVR via an official custom shader interface.
FWIW, I've also asked the LumaSharpen and FineSharp devs (both AviSynth and HLSL), and they were all ok with me using the shaders in madVR. Really, I thought I had everything covered and thought that I did everything correctly. I just wasn't aware of those extended LGPL requirements. I'm working on fixing that right now. |
11th May 2015, 13:09 | #2083 | Link | |
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To be honest, all those license are really complicated and usually an MIT or BSD license is enough to cover you as a developer and give right to other dev to use your work in any kind of settings (with correct credit). The best part of those permissive license, if you feel other are not respecting your work, you can then change the license to a less permissive one. Anyway, you've done nothing wrong, maybe it would have been better that Zachs sent you an MP instead of posting it here, even if it triggered an interesting conversation on the different licenses used. |
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11th May 2015, 13:12 | #2084 | Link | |
Suptitle, MediaPlayer.NET
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There are plenty of ways GPL violation could occur - and they do all the time without the user knowing it - e.g. Using Windows Media Player with LAV Filter is a violation. Like I said, GPL wasn't meant to be used for libraries, let alone binary files that have weights in them or shader files that can be used in other apps. They can be copyrighted, but GPL is the wrong license for it. I work for a global corporation with access to and have been trained frequently by lawyers specializing in patents, copyright and licensing laws. We avoid GPL code like the plague. Think of LGPL is the 'bug-fixed' version of GPL if you like. |
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11th May 2015, 13:17 | #2085 | Link | |
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They all implement a system API, the way the module communicate together is through the system, they are not linked together neither provided as a package. It's the system doing the link, in that case, no violation ensue ... because else, you could go sue Microsoft just because you installed a GPL software on it ... it wouldn't make any sense. |
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11th May 2015, 13:18 | #2086 | Link |
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That's because company lawyers like what we have in our company would be considering it a 'derivative work' - they believe COM is no different from calling something directly as a DLL. Recommending a manual install is a very dangerous practice too.
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11th May 2015, 13:19 | #2087 | Link |
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Well, I guess we can close the issue here. The next madVR build should be fully LGPL compliant (if not, let me know, maybe I missed something again). @Zachs, if I may suggest: Send a PM to tritical, but keep things in MPDN as they are. Then he has the chance to complain, and you did all you could. If he doesn't complain, all is well. My 2cents, at least...
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11th May 2015, 13:20 | #2088 | Link |
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Well if you believe that, then MPDN violates LAVs GPL. Can i haz moneyz noaw?
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LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders |
11th May 2015, 13:21 | #2089 | Link | |
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madVR in MPC-HC is a different matter - that's the opposite of WMP with LAV Filters. What I said before was user using MPC-HC shaders in madVR. |
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11th May 2015, 13:23 | #2090 | Link | |
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That's always what bother me with legal and technical ... two differents reality. |
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11th May 2015, 13:25 | #2091 | Link | ||
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I was talking about the licensing terms in the strictest terms where big corporations are concerned. And the whole point was to say that GPL is the wrong license to use - perhaps consider LGPL for LAV? Commercial apps would have no problem including it. |
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11th May 2015, 13:27 | #2092 | Link |
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LAV was originally based on partial GPL code from MPC-HCs old built-in filters, if anything or how much of that remains is impossible to say - but it also makes it impossible to relicense it LGPL without a lot of research.
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LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders |
11th May 2015, 13:27 | #2093 | Link |
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Yeah it's dynamically loading it (yes it's loaded, it has to be - ask Nev). The mechanism that loads it is besides the point - technically it's still loaded. What companies tend to do is ask the user to install LAV filters on their own so it's the users violating the GPL license, not them (but advising the users would land them in legal troubles).
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11th May 2015, 13:30 | #2095 | Link | |
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It still remains at "22nd December 2013 03:55". |
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11th May 2015, 13:31 | #2096 | Link | |
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In that case, you need to put both license specifying until which version the GPL apply and from which version the LGPL apply. Speaking of license, I saw that ffmpeg also have a tricky licensing system : https://github.com/FFmpeg/FFmpeg/blob/master/LICENSE.md |
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11th May 2015, 13:39 | #2097 | Link |
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BTW, giving special permissions as permitted by GPL is also a sketchy clause (there's no such provision under LGPL by the way) - if Nev were to say MPDN could include LAV Filters as MIT, then if someone uses the LAV Filters from MPDN, but in the source is in every way similar to the GPL version, would they be in violation? See why companies avoid GPL now?
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11th May 2015, 13:41 | #2098 | Link | ||
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I have tried to get rid of some of the old code since it was mostly hacks which were better suited properly re-implemented inside ffmpeg, but some are still present. Quote:
LAV already uses a LGPL build of FFmpeg, fwiw.
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LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders Last edited by nevcairiel; 11th May 2015 at 13:46. |
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