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Old 30th July 2015, 13:39   #541  |  Link
NikosD
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In window mode ?
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Old 30th July 2015, 14:12   #542  |  Link
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In window mode ?
that was rumoured for windows 10 do you have a conformations?

10 bit fullscreen exclusive is from directx feature level 10.x. so you can already assume you need a new feature level that can do this and so most likely not yet existing hardware if they even add 10 bit window mode.
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Old 31st July 2015, 22:03   #543  |  Link
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I was on an insider build and IIRC ms's hevc decoder plays well even if my gpu is an old low_end one.
with the upgrade the app plays only audio and wmp refuse or use lav
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Old 31st July 2015, 22:19   #544  |  Link
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Yes, it seems that MS surprised us all and decided just the last minute before the official release to limit the HEVC decoder only to WDDM 2.0 GPU hardware.

What a nice surprise !
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Old 31st July 2015, 22:22   #545  |  Link
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Is the limitation really for WDDM 2.0 or for GPUs with HEVC DXVA support? Maybe they got scared by HEVC Advance.
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Old 31st July 2015, 22:38   #546  |  Link
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Interesting story about HEVC advance...It's all about money (what a surprise)
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Old 1st August 2015, 03:57   #547  |  Link
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If who interest - Win 10 + GTX 960, vanilla EVR accept P010 for HEVC DXVA 10 bit Test in MPC-BE.
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Old 1st August 2015, 04:51   #548  |  Link
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My Haswell's iGPU accepts P010 using MediaFoundation EVR and MS HEVC decoder for 10bit HEVC.

I guess GTX 960 accepts that too and adds to the equation DirectShow EVR with DS HEVC decoder for 10bit HEVC even using DXVA.
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Old 3rd August 2015, 15:04   #549  |  Link
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My guess is security reasons (Content Protection)
WDDM 2.0 comes not only with advances in Performance and such but it needs the Hardware to securely transmit things more efficiently combined with Uefi and SecureBoot and DXVA Protected Mode
Lot of Layers of Security are enabled now
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Old 4th August 2015, 10:21   #550  |  Link
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About MS MFT HEVC decoder of Win 10

OK...This is a useful post, I think, about one of the most weird decoders I have ever seen - MS MFT HEVC decoder of Win 10.

After a few tests and a few thoughts about this decoder, here is the situation.

MS MFT HEVC decoder is not a DXVA2 decoder.

It's a D3D11 video accelerated decoder only, which means a few things.

D3D11 video acceleration is something that some developers are claiming that you could use in Win 7 with Platform Update installed and create devices with feature level 9_3 in order to work with it, but for example MediaSDK from Intel couldn’t work even in that way because it needs Direct3D 11.1 which is available in Win 8 or above.

So, according to my findings, D3D11 video acceleration is mainly a Win 8 or above feature, although it could work with Win 7 + Platform Update.

Regarding GPU companies and their drivers, it seems that for Intel for example they already have done their job.

MPEG2_VLD,
H264_VLD_NoFGT,
VC1_VLD2000 and
HEVC_VLD_Main

are all DXVA2/D3D11 capable according to DXVA Checker.

So the device decoders are ready to support both modes of HW decode acceleration – DXVA2 and “DXVA11”

Also DXVA11 is similar to DXVA2, the only thing different is the interface above.
Maybe it’s a little trickier too, in order to work compared to DXVA2.

What all these mean ?

It's impossible to connect to EVR with a DXVA11 decoder, like the MS MFT HEVC decoder, so the DXVA Checker could never become red and could never use that decoder to HW accelerate HEVC content because it uses EVR renderer.

So, DXVA Checker will always fall back to SW using MS MFT HEVC decoder in "Playback mode" or "Playback Benchmark" mode as it uses EVR.

BUT using Decode Benchmark mode I managed to HW accelerate HEVC content (from 1080p up to 2160p) in Hybrid mode using GPU ~100% and my Intel Core i7-4790 system using Win 10 x64 and HD 4600 - drivers 4256 (!)

So, it seems that MS MFT HEVC has already enabled HW HEVC acceleration but with two major problems:

a) It's a MediaFoundation only decoder

b) It's a DXVA11 only decoder.

That combination changes the MS MFT HEVC decoder HW acceleration capability, from useful to useless because the two MediaFoundation players that I know - DXVA Checker and WMP - both use EVR renderer so they can't decode and display HEVC content using DXVA11-only decoders, like MS MFT HEVC decoder (!!)

MS MFT HEVC has enabled HW DXVA acceleration that no one can use it.
Only SW fall back for that decoder.

One last thing...

It seems that a system with a Radeon 7750 card (GCN 1.0) and Catalyst 15.7.1 (WDDM 2.0) driver can't use MS MFT HEVC decoder, not even in SW, using Win 10.

It doesn't enumerate in DXVA Checker and it's absent in WMP.

So, my initial thought about WDDM 2.0 drivers seems to be wrong.

Next thing that I thought and asked him if he has an AVX2 capable CPU.

I couldn't think of anything else...
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Old 4th August 2015, 14:47   #551  |  Link
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Sorry but I have no idea what you are talking about ...

"DXVA11" = ? MSDN says it is DXVA2, why you think it is "DXVA11"?
What Intel or AMD GPU support HEVC DXVA2?
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Old 4th August 2015, 15:14   #552  |  Link
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As I wrote above, I call D3D11 video acceleration as DXVA11 because it has no name by Microsoft.

DXVA11 = D3D11 Video acceleration

Intel supports both DXVA2/"DXVA11"

I think the others too.

Read more about D3D11 video acceleration in order to understand the differences with DXVA2
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Old 5th August 2015, 13:50   #553  |  Link
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Congratulations, PotPlayer dev also verified your supposition.
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Old 5th August 2015, 14:17   #554  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosD View Post
It seems that Ivybridge still uses 15.33 driver and not 15.36, so I don't expect Ivy to support DXVA HEVC acceleration.

But have you tried Lentoid HEVC OpenCL decoder or Cyberlink's PowerDVD HEVC OpenCL decoder with Ivy to see of there is any HW acceleration from there ?

Because Ivy supports OpenCL.
.....about Ivy Bridge HD4000 OpenCL HEVC decoding using Lentoid OpenCL, I never got it to work when I was using Win7. I can't recall what error pop up last time whenever lentoid is being loaded.
As for cyberlink = I am too poor to afford one.....

Just now, I tried to install lentoid opencl on win10 (free upgrade from win7). Apparently.....there isnt any opencl support for intel hd4000 for win10 as shown by gpuz 0.8.5
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Old 5th August 2015, 16:23   #555  |  Link
NikosD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanezhiling View Post

Congratulations, PotPlayer dev also verified your supposition.
No, my assumption is wrong because as I wrote in my previous post a Radeon 7750 with Catalyst 15.7.1 and WDDM 2.0, still doesn't have MS MFT HEVC decoder with Win 10.

You have to check my next assumption which is AVX2 instructions.

Quote:
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.....about Ivy Bridge HD4000 OpenCL HEVC decoding using Lentoid OpenCL, I never got it to work when I was using Win7. I can't recall what error pop up last time whenever lentoid is being loaded.
As for cyberlink = I am too poor to afford one.....

Just now, I tried to install lentoid opencl on win10 (free upgrade from win7). Apparently.....there isnt any opencl support for intel hd4000 for win10 as shown by gpuz 0.8.5
Cyberlink's PDVD 15 HEVC decoder is free, because you can take it from the trial PowerDVD 15.
I'll give you instructions how to get it.

Also, GPU-Z is not so reliable for new systems (HW or SW)

I would definitely try realworld OpenCL tests like LuxMark or GPU Caps Viewer which has some built-in easy to test OpenCL tests.

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https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/d...7#post-1865163

Skylake Gen9 GPU supports Feature Level 12_1, it's the most advanced FL12_1 GPU for integrated graphics, AMD can't support FL12_1.
I've read so far only Anandtech's review and I'm shocked by the size of the failure of new Skylake CPU.

For example:
The Core i7-6700K (Skylake) is 5% faster on average than Core i7-4790K (Haswell)

For two generations (Skylake to Haswell) this is simply unacceptable.

Also Skylake is slower in IPC than previous generation Broadwell. This is simply awful.

Also I copy a phrase from Anandtech's review

Quote:

Conclusions on Gaming

There’s no easy way to write this.

Discrete graphics card performance decreases on Skylake over Haswell.
Unbelievable!

Also, the IGP of Core i7-6700K is about 20-25% on average faster than Core i7-4770K and a lot slower than Core i7-5775C in games, according to Anandtech.

No HDMI 2.0

Besides HW HEVC decoding (8bit only) and encoding, I would call Skylake a big failure.
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Old 5th August 2015, 17:22   #556  |  Link
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I have also read the reviews about Skylake. I also havent seen any slide or source mentioning Skylake desktop CPU having GT4e iGPU ( Iris Pro HD580 ). That should be compared to GT3e Iris Pro HD6200 on i7-5775C, btw, not the GT2 on i7-6700K.
In terms of HDMI2.0, is this not a motherboard thing? Some Z170´s have it definately. Why would a Z170 motherboard have HDMI2.0 port when the iGPU on the Z170 CPU cant support it?

Regarding 10-bit HEVC content ( upcoming UltraHD blu-ray ), will Skylake iGPUs ever support full hardware decoding of such content?
If no, there is no need upgrade from Broadwell, which at least has these i7/i5 models. Now its clear why they put these two models out.

Can i7-5775C hybrid decoder decode 60fps high 50Mbps 5.1 level 10-bit HEVC content and not go beyond 20-30% of CPU load?
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Old 5th August 2015, 18:01   #557  |  Link
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You have to check my next assumption which is AVX2 instructions.
my i7 3770k doesn't have AVX2 but the decoder was working with my gtx 760. now i put my r9 270 in the system because the gtx 760 just died and now the decoder doesn't work at least not now.

but AVX2 can't be the reason.
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Old 5th August 2015, 18:14   #558  |  Link
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It's not WDDM 2.0 (because AMD cards with WDDM 2.0 do not work) and it's not AVX2 because Ivy works.

OK...

So, it needs WDDM 2.0 but not AMD cards...Simple
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Old 5th August 2015, 18:16   #559  |  Link
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my HTPC with AVX2 and the same card had a working decoder.
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Old 5th August 2015, 18:20   #560  |  Link
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Someone with a lot of different generations HW can do the combinations in order to find out what's going on before the official explanation - I hope to give that explanation - from MS.

Looks like something with WDDM 2.0 and AVX2.
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