Any news about a potential successor to VVC / H.266?

[rwill]

Can't wait for Xerox Moments when encoding...

Otherwise just a note: Mpeg-1 and Mpeg-2 have around the same efficiency. It is just that Mpeg-2 supports interlaced.

Mpeg-1 is quite superior to H.261 (50%+ reduction ?) though because H.261 has very limited motion compensation. It is H.261 that has no predecessor

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by rwill

Can't wait for Xerox Moments when encoding...

Otherwise just a note: Mpeg-1 and Mpeg-2 have around the same efficiency. It is just that Mpeg-2 supports interlaced.

Mpeg-1 is quite superior to H.261 (50%+ reduction ?) though because H.261 has very limited motion compensation. It is H.261 that has no predecessor

MPEG-2 also added half-per motion compensation to MPEG-1, which was a significant efficiency improvement.

[rwill]

I am pretty positive that Mpeg-1 already had Half Pel MC, having implemented Mpeg-1/2 encoders, decoders and the like.

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by rwill

I am pretty positive that Mpeg-1 already had Half Pel MC, having implemented Mpeg-1/2 encoders, decoders and the like.

You are correct.

And sheesh, that was so long ago now!

[modus-ms325c]

maybe it's about time we brought MPEG-1/2 back from the ashes...

[kurkosdr]

Originally Posted by modus-ms325c

maybe it's about time we brought MPEG-1/2 back from the ashes...

What do you mean by "bring MPEG-1/2 back from the ashes"? MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 are still used when compatibility with old equipment or old formats (VCD and DVD-Video accordingly) is desired, they never went away. Especially not MPEG-2.

But use them for modern things like HD? Hell no. Even if you want something royalty-free and ISO standard, MPEG-4 Part 2 is reasonably well-supported and is royalty-free except in Brazil (and will be fully royalty-free sometime in 2026). MPEG-2 is royalty-free except in Malaysia (and won't be royalty-free until sometime in 2035 due to submarine patents in that country). There is no reason to use MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 other than compatibility with old equipment or old formats.

[FranceBB]

Well, as someone who encodes MPEG-2 stuff regularly, I wouldn't mind if someone got the old encoders polished (HC-ENC, x262, lavc). Ideally it would be nice to have a properly multi thread and numa node aware open source MPEG-2 encoder. I mean, sure, the encoding complexity of MPEG-2 is very low for modern CPUs, but the problem is that most of the time we're limited in the amount of resources used, not to mention that most encoders are either plain C / C++ only or have only old assembly optimizations like SSE2 and could benefit from multithreading and assembly optimizations up to AVX512, but I guess no one will ever spend time doing that...

[rwill]

Don't think that Mpeg-2 can benefit from anything above SSE2. 16x16 Macroblocks and all.

Regarding good Mpeg-2 encoders, I have done multiple tests over the years and I am still looking for some free encoder to beat my y262 encoder in metrics/subjective quality... but one does not simply switch horses at the end of the race right?

[modus-ms325c]

Originally Posted by rwill

Regarding good Mpeg-2 encoders, I have done multiple tests over the years and I am still looking for some free encoder to beat my y262 encoder in metrics/subjective quality... but one does not simply switch horses at the end of the race right?

idk man, maybe work on y262's missing features first since no one else will or is unable to do so for you

[rwill]

Originally Posted by modus-ms325c

idk man, maybe work on y262's missing features first since no one else will or is unable to do so for you

So... whats missing really?

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by kurkosdr

What do you mean by "bring MPEG-1/2 back from the ashes"? MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 are still used when compatibility with old equipment or old formats (VCD and DVD-Video accordingly) is desired, they never went away. Especially not MPEG-2.

Are you aware of anyone still making VCDs this decade? If so, do you know why? I would think that those old pre-DVD VCD players used for movie piracy back in the day would have all broken down ages ago.

It's delightful to see ancient tech still being used!

Last I heard, the US Navy was still using VC-1 on submarines.

[rwill]

High Flyer – Etihad’s inflight entertainment

Thales and Panasonic have different audio and video encoding requirements. Panasonic requires its video files to be encoded at MPEG 4 1.5mbps with 16:9 aspect ratio, and its audio files in mp3 at 128kbps. Thales requires Hollywood movies to be encoded in MPEG 1 at 1.5mbps with an aspect ratio of 4:3 and MPEG 2 in 16:9. All other video content for Thales is encoded in MPEG 1 at 1.5mbps aspect ratio 4:3, while audio files have the same format as Panasonic.

Article is from 2017 and airplanes do not get upgrades often?

[modus-ms325c]

Originally Posted by rwill

So... whats missing really?

[rwill]

Originally Posted by modus-ms325c

It does not have Frame Threading because it has Slice Threading. Slice Threading is the more sane choice for Mpeg-2.

About Dual Prime and Field Pictures, do you know what these are and where they have a real world use case?

[modus-ms325c]

I don't know what they are, haven't seen what they do in practice, and was most definitely not the writer of a README that consists of these phrases.

[rwill]

Originally Posted by modus-ms325c

I don't know what they are, haven't seen what they do in practice, and was most definitely not the writer of a README that consists of these phrases.

Then please be more careful with statements like these:

idk man, maybe work on y262's missing features first since no one else will or is unable to do so for you

[modus-ms325c]

*** edited ***

[avih]

@modus-ms325c next time it's a ban. Please behave.

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by rwill

High Flyer – Etihad’s inflight entertainment

Article is from 2017 and airplanes do not get upgrades often?

The in-seat entertainment gets updated more frequently than you might think, as newer generations can save a lot of weight, thus fuel, and thus operating expenses. Some of the older systems were quite a few kilos per seat, including wiring.

Some airlines, like Alaska, have ditched in-seat entertainment entirely and just give everyone free WiFi access to the preloaded content library on the plane. That lets them use H.264 + AAC-LC at the minimum, and it would probably work to make it HEVC today. That said, I don't think compression efficiency is directly tied to cost savings anymore, so they'll emphasize compatibility over that. Once you've got the WiFi to handle one codec, a more efficient one doesn't help that much. And while better compression could store more titles, storage is also getting cheaper on its own. I expect that they're more limited by licensing than storage anyway.

[kurkosdr]

Originally Posted by rwill

It does not have Frame Threading because it has Slice Threading. Slice Threading is the more sane choice for Mpeg-2.

About Dual Prime and Field Pictures, do you know what these are and where they have a real world use case?

If memory serves me well, a "field-picture" encodes a pair of interlaced fields (top and bottom field). Basically, in MPEG-2, in interlaced mode, you can either have a picture encoded as a progressive frame or as a pair of fields. The first type of picture is useful for "fake interlace" (needed to get a 25p video on DVD-Video because DVD-Video doesn't support progressive mode for example) or for scenes with zero motion in true interlaced video, and the other is for scenes with motion in true interlaced video.

Note: when I say "true interlaced video" I mean the kind of interlaced video that would give you those annoying comb artifacts during motion if you tried to weave/overlay its field-pairs into frames.

If so, does it mean y262 can't encode true interlaced video?