Haali Renderer - Page 4

LoRd_MuldeR · 14th March 2006, 23:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Egh

2 All:

You have to try harder to produce some more consistent report on this problem. The point is that Haali himself tried but failed to reproduce that bug.

It seems it's related to some specific DX/drivers/Card.

I use latest MPC build from Celtic Druid.
OS is WinXP (32-Bit) with SP-1.
Card is ATI Radeon 9800 Pro with Radeon Omega Drivers 3.8.221 (Catalyst 6.2)
And I use DirectX 9.0c (Feb 2006 release)

Again: Takes at least 10-15 seconds to start playback.
Computer is frozen during this time...

OCedHrt · 15th March 2006, 03:08

At first I thought it might just be the ATI cards, but it seems some GeForce users are having problems too.

flanger216 · 15th March 2006, 05:18

Using Zoomplayer with the latest FFDshow on my Radeon x1300, there's a roughly 5-10 delay, the length of which seems to be directly proportional to how much video cache I use.

Also, very rarely I come upon a video that doesn't seek properly when I use the Haali renderer, but works fine when I use VMR9.

Scoty · 15th March 2006, 10:18

i use the latest MPC with Haalis Reenderer and the NVidia PureVideo Decoder but how can i set Force RGB32 output ? in the new MPC i can not find the settings.

Egh · 15th March 2006, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoty

i use the latest MPC with Haalis Reenderer and the NVidia PureVideo Decoder but how can i set Force RGB32 output ? in the new MPC i can not find the settings.

RGB32 is enforced in the decoder. So e.g. if you use ffdshow you can disable output in YV12, YUY2 etc, apart from RGB32.

Egh · 15th March 2006, 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by flanger216

Also, very rarely I come upon a video that doesn't seek properly when I use the Haali renderer, but works fine when I use VMR9.

If that problem is reproducible (would like to know parameters of the file at least, i.e. which tracks it has, which container etc) can you upload some fragment of that to lets' say rapidshare?

Scoty · 15th March 2006, 19:21

i found a other problem with Haalis Reenderer. i dont have picture on my TV. with the standart output i have a TV picture but with Haalis Reenderer i see only black screen on my TV (SVHS). what can i do ?

flanger216 · 15th March 2006, 23:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Egh

If that problem is reproducible (would like to know parameters of the file at least, i.e. which tracks it has, which container etc) can you upload some fragment of that to lets' say rapidshare?

Yeah, sorry for the vague bug-report. The files were all MP42 encodes, and I remember there being some sort of problem with their indexes. Unfortunately, I've since deleted them and don't recall where I got them. Again, definitely not a big bug and probably an issue with the video-files themselves.

Egh · 16th March 2006, 04:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoty

i found a other problem with Haalis Reenderer. i dont have picture on my TV. with the standart output i have a TV picture but with Haalis Reenderer i see only black screen on my TV (SVHS). what can i do ?

What kind of standard output do you use? Overlay or VMR9?

Scoty · 16th March 2006, 09:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Egh

What kind of standard output do you use? Overlay or VMR9?

overlay.

Egh · 16th March 2006, 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoty

overlay.

Try if same effect is with VMR9 btw. Of course Haali renderer doesn't use overlay

Scoty · 16th March 2006, 19:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Egh

Try if same effect is with VMR9 btw. Of course Haali renderer doesn't use overlay

will work tv out only with overlay over svhs ?

Egh · 17th March 2006, 04:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoty

will work tv out only with overlay over svhs ?

That's for you to research. In context of this thread you need to make sure that bugs are caused specifically by Haali renderer, not due to, like in this case, not using overlay.

KoD · 25th March 2006, 11:53

Finally I can post on this board. The 5 days delay set between registering and being able to post sure is annoying.

1. People having issues with high CPU load when using YV12 or YUY2 output colorsapce from their decoder (ffdshow by default options, divx/xvid by default, too). It seems that this causes the driver to work overtime (at least on ATi cards from the 9xxx series and systems with single core CPU) and that's why you get a very high CPU usage. Force RGB32 output in your video decoder (in ffdshow, uncheck YV12 and YUY2 modes, in divx I believe there is no way to force RGB output, in XviD there's an option to force the output colorspace to RGB32). This will make your video playback run at normal (read proper) CPU usage again.

2. "I don't use YV12/YUY2 in my video driver but I can still use Haali's renderer although it's supposed to only work with YUY2 or RGB input. And this works on some files but it doesn't on others !". Most likely you were not aware of all the filters in the video rendering chain. Probably you have files with subtitles which make vsfilter to be loaded, and guess what happens... vsfilter performs the colorspace conversion from YV12 to YUY2 ! Check this by enabling the OSD page in vsfilter options and look at the input colorspace and the output one. This also means that CPU usage will be higher on certain video cards/CPU combinations, because of the problem mentioned at point 1). Feeding the renderer with YUY2 (from vsfilter output) -> high CPU usage. So, it's better to force RGB output in the video decoder.

3. High load times when opening a video file. This happens to me too, P4 2.4GHz, Ati Radeon 9700 Pro card, latest Dx, WMP10 on clean WinXp SP2 install.

4. One real problem I have noticed is tearing. This happens on all files but it's easy to spot only on those with high motion or flickering image. Haali said he'd be working on this (that was a few weeks ago).

5. Haali's renderer does not use Overlay ! It uses YUY2/RGB texture/render surfaces, just like VMR9 does ! So, of course using Overlay output will give nothing on TV-out ! And having TV-out output would probably require some other things to be implemented, things that were not really a proirity for a test release...

Egh · 25th March 2006, 16:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by KoD

1.

2.

5.

As for 1. and 5. I pretty much told the same already

As for number 2, it could be a good explanation. I myself don't use VSFilter though :P

"And having TV-out output would probably require some other things to be implemented, things that were not really a proirity for a test release..." First, I think you still can get TV out if you change drivers configuration settings, and second, the current release of Haali renderer is no way a test release

Test releases were prior 25th of Feb, and were not available to public.

KoD · 25th March 2006, 21:42

It does look as a test release though because of the warning that's posted on Haali's website.

Regarding number 2: play the file in MPC and use graphedit to connect to the filter graph. Is there anything between the output of the video decoder and the input in Haali's renderer ?
(because magic doesn't happen ^^ )

Egh · 26th March 2006, 02:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by KoD

It does look as a test release though because of the warning that's posted on Haali's website.

where is it exactly?

Quote:

Originally Posted by KoD

Regarding number 2: play the file in MPC and use graphedit to connect to the filter graph. Is there anything between the output of the video decoder and the input in Haali's renderer ?
(because magic doesn't happen ^^ )

And what should be there?

KoD · 26th March 2006, 10:16

I'm sorry. Looking again on the webpage I see no warning about potential problems with the splitter. I could have sworn, though... ^^;

As for the other problem, there should be something that performs the color space conversion. Except the case that this color psace conversion is performed by the video driver (unlikely), there must be something that does it.

futurex · 26th March 2006, 13:59

i dont know if this has been answered already, but the delay when using haali renderer looks like its depends on the decoder. try forcing dscaler for dvd/mpeg2, when compared to intervideo for example.

on my system, using dscaler it loads instantly, while intervideo takes around 10-15 seconds

breez · 26th March 2006, 14:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by futurex

i dont know if this has been answered already, but the delay when using haali renderer looks like its depends on the decoder. try forcing dscaler for dvd/mpeg2, when compared to intervideo for example.

on my system, using dscaler it loads instantly, while intervideo takes around 10-15 seconds

Make sure Haali renderer is on the filters list when you use Dscaler decoder. Dscaler probably outputs YV12 by default (it is switchable to YUY2 through the decoder's settings and no "auto" setting available) and that just won't work with the current Haali renderer and thus another renderer will be used (VMR7 seems to be the fallback renderer of choice in MPC).

25th March 2006, 11:53	#74 \| Link
KoD Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 567	Finally I can post on this board. The 5 days delay set between registering and being able to post sure is annoying. 1. People having issues with high CPU load when using YV12 or YUY2 output colorsapce from their decoder (ffdshow by default options, divx/xvid by default, too). It seems that this causes the driver to work overtime (at least on ATi cards from the 9xxx series and systems with single core CPU) and that's why you get a very high CPU usage. Force RGB32 output in your video decoder (in ffdshow, uncheck YV12 and YUY2 modes, in divx I believe there is no way to force RGB output, in XviD there's an option to force the output colorspace to RGB32). This will make your video playback run at normal (read proper) CPU usage again. 2. "I don't use YV12/YUY2 in my video driver but I can still use Haali's renderer although it's supposed to only work with YUY2 or RGB input. And this works on some files but it doesn't on others !". Most likely you were not aware of all the filters in the video rendering chain. Probably you have files with subtitles which make vsfilter to be loaded, and guess what happens... vsfilter performs the colorspace conversion from YV12 to YUY2 ! Check this by enabling the OSD page in vsfilter options and look at the input colorspace and the output one. This also means that CPU usage will be higher on certain video cards/CPU combinations, because of the problem mentioned at point 1). Feeding the renderer with YUY2 (from vsfilter output) -> high CPU usage. So, it's better to force RGB output in the video decoder. 3. High load times when opening a video file. This happens to me too, P4 2.4GHz, Ati Radeon 9700 Pro card, latest Dx, WMP10 on clean WinXp SP2 install. 4. One real problem I have noticed is tearing. This happens on all files but it's easy to spot only on those with high motion or flickering image. Haali said he'd be working on this (that was a few weeks ago). 5. Haali's renderer does not use Overlay ! It uses YUY2/RGB texture/render surfaces, just like VMR9 does ! So, of course using Overlay output will give nothing on TV-out ! And having TV-out output would probably require some other things to be implemented, things that were not really a proirity for a test release... Last edited by KoD; 25th March 2006 at 12:15.

15th March 2006, 03:08	#62 \| Link
OCedHrt Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 58	At first I thought it might just be the ATI cards, but it seems some GeForce users are having problems too.

15th March 2006, 05:18	#63 \| Link
flanger216 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 140	Using Zoomplayer with the latest FFDshow on my Radeon x1300, there's a roughly 5-10 delay, the length of which seems to be directly proportional to how much video cache I use. Also, very rarely I come upon a video that doesn't seek properly when I use the Haali renderer, but works fine when I use VMR9.

15th March 2006, 10:18	#64 \| Link
Scoty Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 108	i use the latest MPC with Haalis Reenderer and the NVidia PureVideo Decoder but how can i set Force RGB32 output ? in the new MPC i can not find the settings.

15th March 2006, 19:21	#67 \| Link
Scoty Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 108	i found a other problem with Haalis Reenderer. i dont have picture on my TV. with the standart output i have a TV picture but with Haalis Reenderer i see only black screen on my TV (SVHS). what can i do ?

25th March 2006, 21:42	#76 \| Link
KoD Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 567	It does look as a test release though because of the warning that's posted on Haali's website. Regarding number 2: play the file in MPC and use graphedit to connect to the filter graph. Is there anything between the output of the video decoder and the input in Haali's renderer ? (because magic doesn't happen ^^ )

26th March 2006, 10:16	#78 \| Link
KoD Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 567	I'm sorry. Looking again on the webpage I see no warning about potential problems with the splitter. I could have sworn, though... ^^; As for the other problem, there should be something that performs the color space conversion. Except the case that this color psace conversion is performed by the video driver (unlikely), there must be something that does it.

26th March 2006, 13:59	#79 \| Link
futurex Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 155	i dont know if this has been answered already, but the delay when using haali renderer looks like its depends on the decoder. try forcing dscaler for dvd/mpeg2, when compared to intervideo for example. on my system, using dscaler it loads instantly, while intervideo takes around 10-15 seconds