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Old 9th January 2017, 00:05   #41961  |  Link
wysiwygbg
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madVR incompatibility

Hello nice people .

I've been fiddling around with 3D for some time, and lately I wanted to get away from PowerDVD and TMT for playing 3D BluRays.

I've taken the time to read some instructions and contacted a friend of mine who also is using alternative players, and after some chatting yesterday we got to a problem that apparently I'm having. So what we both did is:
Installed MPC-HC 1.7.10
Installed LAV filters 0.69
Installed madVR 0.91.4

At his place he has a HDMI 1.4 capable 3D display, and everything started working almost immediately, with no specifics with the settings.

However at my place I'm running a HDMI 1.3 capable 3D display (Panasonic Viera TC-P65VT30) which is working fine with PowerDVD and TMT, but won't work at all with madVR.

I was wondering if madVR supports frame interleave playback instead of frame packed playback, so it somehow could work properly with my display?

Thank you in advance for any advice you give me .
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Old 9th January 2017, 00:45   #41962  |  Link
Asmodian
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
madVR v0.91.5 released

http://madshi.net/madVR.zip

Code:
* added direct 4x NGU upscalers
Wow, I am very impressed by NGU x4 for SD content! Much of the very bad amplification of artifacts I noticed when upscaling 640x480 -> 4K is gone! I would love to see a x3 version, even if it was the same speed and power, for 720p -> 4K.

It still shows artifacts much more than NNEDI3 256 but NNEDI3 is noticeably softer too. NGU x4 requires a very high quality source for SD but with one I like the look more than NNEDI3.

I will probably still use NNEDI3 by default for SD though, most of my SD sources have too much edge noise.

I also want to note your very impressive work on "ShowRenderSteps" in the previous version; rendering seems the same speed as without it and I see some filter passes taking as little as 0.04 ms.

edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by wysiwygbg View Post
I was wondering if madVR supports frame interleave playback instead of frame packed playback, so it somehow could work properly with my display?
In the properties of your display device there is a 3D format section: auto, side-by-side, top-and-bottom, row alternative, column alternative. Also a swap left / right eye option.

No frame interleave.
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Old 9th January 2017, 06:09   #41963  |  Link
wysiwygbg
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Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
In the properties of your display device there is a 3D format section: auto, side-by-side, top-and-bottom, row alternative, column alternative. Also a swap left / right eye option.

No frame interleave.
Yeah, I've already tried all of the above and none of them work. So is there going to be frame interleave support in the foreseeable future? Does this mean that all TV sets made before 2012, and working with HDMI 1.3, are currently unsupported by madVR for watching 3D?
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Old 9th January 2017, 06:12   #41964  |  Link
Asmodian
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I remember madshi saying there weren't any plans to support frame interleaved 3D. There was a technical issue if I remember correctly?

So yes, all 3D TVs with HDMI 1.3 aren't supported.
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Old 9th January 2017, 09:35   #41965  |  Link
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Quote:
madVR v0.91.5 released
madshi, with chroma doubling set to normal NGU now puts much less strain on my RX 470. Now i can use NGU very high comfortable!
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Old 9th January 2017, 11:11   #41966  |  Link
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I run SR2 with some sources and couldn't understand why it doesn't quadro for me, apparently direct x4 NGU doesn't work if you have superres enabled in refinement.

Besides this little bug(?) it runs way better, I can do very high easily now on SD stuff. what was 18ms at high now 13ms at veryhigh

Can't say if it's softer yet, but what if we have a check box for NGU like with SSIM relaxed-strict(soft) because as this forum shows there is two distinct camps that like soft and sharp images and do not understand each other at all.
I'm in sharp camp, and option like that would be nice.
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Old 9th January 2017, 11:59   #41967  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wysiwygbg View Post

... if madVR supports frame interleave playback instead of frame packed playback, ...
I think it is better to say 3D frame sequential mode -
(sending alternating left and right eye image frames) - which is the known name in the 3D TV formats (frame sequential, frame packing).

PowerDVD supports this mode not having the option frame sequential but HDMI 1.4, which actually is frame packing.
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Old 9th January 2017, 12:29   #41968  |  Link
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Hi madshi, I have found that if I use NGU very high instead of quadrupling it keeps doubling twice, it works well with medium and high though. Using low just reports NGU low (without 4x) but it may be an OSD trouble. But I am sure that very high quadrupling it is not working well in my case because it is sharper than quadrupling with high. Thanks for this release, quadrupling looks great with SD content. Also please don't forget to add LL to OSD and adding an option to prevent auto quadrupling. Thank in advance for your hard work.
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Old 9th January 2017, 14:21   #41969  |  Link
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Is it normal to have multiple madHcCtrl.exe running while playing a video?
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Old 9th January 2017, 17:36   #41970  |  Link
alexnt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Catmull-Rom is Cubic -> Bicubic50, but you don't use downscaling when watching 720p or 1080p on a 1080p display.

Jinc is always 3 taps now, the 4+ options have been removed because they only made the quality worse.

Image doubling is set in Image Upscaling now, simply choose a doubling algorithm (super-xbr, NNEDI3, NGU). I recommend you test NGU for yourself, for 720p -> 1080p it is more subtle, but it is madshi's amazing new scaler that is very sharp but without artifacts. It runs quite well on the r9 290.

edit: DX11 is the preferred option for AMD GPUs. AMD just seems to like directX 11 more, there have been many user reports of issues with the various DX9 modes and AMD GPUs.
Thank you for the information. So , I set chroma upscaling-> jinc and image downscaling-> catmull-rom.
For image upscaling I set NGU with luma-> high, chroma-> high and algorithm after doubling, upscaling-> jinc and downscaling -> same as image downscaling(that is catmull-rom). http://prnt.sc/dtgdff
What is your opinion? Are these settings too much for generic use(watching movies)?

Output of 1080 movie: http://prnt.sc/dtgbf6
Output for 720 movie: http://prnt.sc/dtgaq9

Just one more question. I used to watch movies with letterboxing. So now that madvr can handle scalings in a better way than the player itself I want to know which is the best setting to upscale the non true 1080p files(like 1920x800) or the 720p files to 1080p to cover the whole screen.
If I use in mpc (right click)video frame-> zoom 1 I loose a bit from the edges of the film. If zoom 2 a little more. If I use touch window from outside I loose a bit more from zoom 2.
If I use scale to 16:9 TV people in the movie seem more streched (I don't how to describe it) and if I use zoom to widescreen I loose again part from the edges of the movie.
What is the best setting in your opinion or what is the most mainstream setting.
Sorry for my english again.
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Old 9th January 2017, 18:44   #41971  |  Link
leonccyiu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fedpul View Post
Hi madshi, I have found that if I use NGU very high instead of quadrupling it keeps doubling twice, it works well with medium and high though. Using low just reports NGU low (without 4x) but it may be an OSD trouble. But I am sure that very high quadrupling it is not working well in my case because it is sharper than quadrupling with high. Thanks for this release, quadrupling looks great with SD content. Also please don't forget to add LL to OSD and adding an option to prevent auto quadrupling. Thank in advance for your hard work.
If you set the Chroma to normal just below the luma in the NGU option of image upscaling, NGU very high will be x4.
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Old 9th January 2017, 19:44   #41972  |  Link
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If you set the Chroma to normal just below the luma in the NGU option of image upscaling, NGU very high will be x4.
Thanks! That was my fault. I did not read what madshi writes in his post.
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Old 10th January 2017, 05:30   #41973  |  Link
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I currently have a GTX 1060 Founder's Edition with a 400 Watt power supply. While playing 1080p content with fairly high madVR settings I am pulling at max about 220 Watts total for my system measuring with Kill-A-Watt. From benchmarks, I've seen from Anandtech that the GTX 1060 FE pulls about 264 Watts while the GTX 1080 FE pulls about 335 Watts under load while running Crysis 3. Would I be safe to replace my 1060 FE with a 1080 FE for madVR duties, and if so, would I get a substantial performance increase in madVR using the GTX 1080 using the same 400 Watt power supply over the GTX 1060?
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Old 10th January 2017, 06:13   #41974  |  Link
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Would I be safe to replace my 1060 FE with a 1080 FE for madVR duties
Yes, provided it's not a cheap PSU.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lubczyk View Post
Would I get a substantial performance increase in madVR using the GTX 1080 using the same 400 Watt power supply over the GTX 1060?
Yes, enable the settings you'd want to enable with the extra performance you'd stand to gain from upgrading and determine if it's worth it to you first, unless you plan on also using it for gaming.
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Old 10th January 2017, 07:33   #41975  |  Link
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Yes, provided it's not a cheap PSU.



Yes, enable the settings you'd want to enable with the extra performance you'd stand to gain from upgrading and determine if it's worth it to you first, unless you plan on also using it for gaming.
Thank you for the answer. One more question. You mentioned that a cheap PSU would be bad. What would be the difference between different PSU brands if they all rated for 400 Watts?
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Old 10th January 2017, 07:36   #41976  |  Link
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Thank you for the answer. One more question. You mentioned that a cheap PSU would be bad. What would be the difference between different PSU brands if they all rated for 400 Watts?
Stability of the various voltage rails, component & design quality which affects maximum output and system stability. Just read a good PSU review and you'll learn everything you need to know.
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Old 10th January 2017, 08:32   #41977  |  Link
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Would someone tell my what are good settings for upscaling DVD to 1080p please?
Im projecting them to a large screen so want them to look as good as possible with few artefacts.
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Old 10th January 2017, 13:30   #41978  |  Link
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Would someone tell my what are good settings for upscaling DVD to 1080p please?
Im projecting them to a large screen so want them to look as good as possible with few artefacts.
There's no single answer to this, and you don't mention what graphics card you're using, but try madshi's new NGU 4x (go back a few posts for how to enable). It's a bit too sharp for me, but might be just the thing for a projector.
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Old 10th January 2017, 14:34   #41979  |  Link
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Smooth edges seems to be broken with the 4x NGU step, doesn't show any effect then.
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Old 10th January 2017, 17:57   #41980  |  Link
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4x looks great to me - definitely better than doubling twice.
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling

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