Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion.

Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules.

 

Go Back   Doom9's Forum > Hardware & Software > Software players

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 26th February 2017, 22:41   #42761  |  Link
LexSfX
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Nearest neighbor was only ever there to demonstrate how bad it is. I never intended anybody to actually use it. Why would you prefer it over other scaling options?

Try super-xbr or the new NGU pixart test builds. They should make your TASvideos look much better.
I guess you don't understand. Seeing the individual pixels is important in watching retro speed runs; especially tool-assisted speed runs, as pixel-perfect play is common there. I don't want a blurry image or distorted-shaped pixels when upscaling such videos. Also, I agree that nearest-neighbor is relatively bad, as my post explained. The algorithm I linked to in my post is a superior algorithm to nearest neighbor, as it hides the misshapen-pixels problem nearest neighbor has without eliminating its crystal clarity.

Unless loading custom shader presets such as those at https://github.com/libretro/slang-shaders and https://github.com/libretro/common-shaders is added, I may have to stick with madVR v0.93.1 indefinitely. Actually, that would be an awesome idea. There are tons of awesome shader presets there that would be nice to use in a media player.
LexSfX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th February 2017, 23:37   #42762  |  Link
kalston
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 164
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexSfX View Post
I guess you don't understand. Seeing the individual pixels is important in watching retro speed runs; especially tool-assisted speed runs, as pixel-perfect play is common there. I don't want a blurry image or distorted-shaped pixels when upscaling such videos. Also, I agree that nearest-neighbor is relatively bad, as my post explained. The algorithm I linked to in my post is a superior algorithm to nearest neighbor, as it hides the misshapen-pixels problem nearest neighbor has without eliminating its crystal clarity.

Unless loading custom shader presets such as those at https://github.com/libretro/slang-shaders and https://github.com/libretro/common-shaders is added, I may have to stick with madVR v0.93.1 indefinitely. Actually, that would be an awesome idea. There are tons of awesome shader presets there that would be nice to use in a media player.
In the shortcuts section, you can make keybinds to enable nearest neighbour for chroma & luma (even with the latest version). This is what I do when I want to use it (which is not often and mostly for testing purposes). Maybe that would be good enough for you?

Last edited by kalston; 26th February 2017 at 23:41.
kalston is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 02:54   #42763  |  Link
LexSfX
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 36
I am guessing "luma" here is "image upscaling". You're saying "keyboard shortcuts" contains an "image upscaling algorithm - set to 'Nearest Neighbor'" entry, even after the version that removed the radio button selection for it from the GUI? If so, thanks for the info. I'll check that out when I have a reason to update.

Also, why do you seem so embarrassed about using nearest neighbor that you have to write "which is not often and mostly for testing purposes"? Nearest neighbor is the only truly sharp algorithm provided by madVR for low-res pixel art video (256224, for example). There are better shader presets for non-integer upscaling like "anti-aliased nearest neighbor", "pixellate", and "sharp bilinear", but madVR has never provided any of those so nearest neighbor will have to do. There's no shame in wanting to use nearest neighbor for some video content, to be able to inspect the pixels clearly. Nearest neighbor is perfect for integer upscaling, too. I don't see an option in madVR for that though.
LexSfX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 03:42   #42764  |  Link
kalston
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 164
Yes the "luma upscaling" wording has been changed to "image upscaling" now but that is what I mean. And I have made shortcuts for those in the latest madVR version so yes it still works (even though it has been removed from other places in the GUI).

Mind you it will reset to your settings from the "scaling algorithm" section when you close madVR. Not a problem for me but if you need to have it enabled by default it's not an ideal solution.

And I'm not "ashamed" of using it It's simply not very often that I want to. I mean, I mostly use madVR to watch blu-rays upscaled to 1440p so it wouldn't really do much good for that purpose

Last edited by kalston; 27th February 2017 at 03:47.
kalston is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 09:26   #42765  |  Link
Mistery 73
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
Display rate changer? Simple profile stuff, you know this?
not all are born learned you know that?
Mistery 73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 11:35   #42766  |  Link
Razoola
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 454
Is there any reason why with the following in madvr's monitors display properties, it will select 2160p30 for 25hz material?

2160p23, 2160p24, 2160p25, 2160p29, 2160p30

If I remove 2160p30 then it will choose 2060p29 fullscreen, only after I remove 2160p29 also will it correctly set the refresh rate to 2160p25.
Razoola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 12:07   #42767  |  Link
ryrynz
Registered User
 
ryrynz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,029
Probably best looking at the properties of the file and making sure it's reported as 25fps to madVR. Check CTRL-J.
ryrynz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 12:26   #42768  |  Link
Damien147
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 268
@Razoola

Tranfa user here has similar problem,try to add 2160p50 if you have 50hz option.
Damien147 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 14:40   #42769  |  Link
tranfa
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien147 View Post
@Razoola

Tranfa user here has similar problem,try to add 2160p50 if you have 50hz option.
Yes, 100% the same problem.

I enclosed my logs a couple of pages before this one.
tranfa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 14:42   #42770  |  Link
tranfa
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
Probably best looking at the properties of the file and making sure it's reported as 25fps to madVR. Check CTRL-J.
In my case the answer is yes, CTRL-J reports the correct fps.
tranfa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2017, 16:19   #42771  |  Link
Damien147
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 268
If you had 50hz option problem was gonna get solved.I reproduced it.
Damien147 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 09:33   #42772  |  Link
Damien147
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 268
@tranfa

It seems that someone reported it.I guess you have to be patient.
I'm waiting too for the dxva2(native)10 bit HEVC black screen to be fixed cause I can't play high bitrate 10 bit HEVC.DXVA2(copyback) is a slideshow with 10 bit HEVC.Non 10 bit HEVC play fine with DXVA2(copyback) and the weird is that my GPU supposedly can handle it.For now only option is EVR(CP) but luckily I am fine with 20GB movie which I can handle with software decoding.
Seems that I can go till 10bit HEVC ~50Mbps for now with software but I am on the edge,not bad.

Last edited by Damien147; 28th February 2017 at 12:57.
Damien147 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 12:46   #42773  |  Link
HillieSan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 119
I have more succes with DXVA (native), EVR and potplayer. MPC BE/HC show judder.
HillieSan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 12:53   #42774  |  Link
Damien147
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 268
I have more success with DXVA2 (native) too in general but with Madvr(and 10 bit HEVC ) I get black screen.About the judder smooth motion in Madvr doesn't go well with you?

Last edited by Damien147; 28th February 2017 at 13:30.
Damien147 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 13:53   #42775  |  Link
huhn
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,363
not everyone has the same issue so it is not 100% clear this is a madVR issue.

high CPU usages doesn't make a lot of sense with copyback. it's not like the copy back for 10 bit images is a lot bigger/harder than 8 bit.
and no the codec doesn't matter with copyback.
huhn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 14:20   #42776  |  Link
Damien147
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 268
The thing is that I can't use DXVA2 with everything in general using Madvr.Copyback was gonna be the best thing but for some reason my system can't handle it with 10bit HEVC,too slow.Others with same GPU can handle it.So...only software decoding for now.For the 99% of situations I'm fine,so no big deal.It's not an everytime/day problem.
Three more here with AMD rx4x0 reproduced the 10bit HEVC dxva2(native) black screen.We all four had normal playback with EVR(CP).
If I get worst PQ with dxva2(native) I ain't gonna use that though.(oh boy...someone's gonna shoot me.)



I have an old cpu(i5 760 oced 3800) which performance wise is like i5-2400(Sandy Bridge).My gpu(rx470) can handle 10bit hevc with DXVA2(copyback) as other users here report but I can't.Could it be a bottleneck from cpu for some reason?Some instruction missing or something?I don't get high cpu load with DXVA2(copyback) to see the ''bottleneck'' if it exists but 10 bit HEVC is slideshow.

Last edited by Damien147; 28th February 2017 at 15:07.
Damien147 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 16:40   #42777  |  Link
baii
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 180
Quote:
Originally Posted by leeperry View Post
Is there any way to check that 10bit got enabled apart from mVR's OSD? Test patterns maybe? That's what this guy does:

AMD 4x0's support HDMI 2.0b so I don't see why 2160p60 would be an issue, eventually my goal is to go 3x720p@60Hz with FRC
You can use the grey scale gradient(or the ring test file) that people use to check for Photoshop 10bit path. Turn off dithering and if everything is running 10bit(including the panel,native or FRC), it will be smooth. No card do 4k60 at 10bit now though. So you probably need to use 4k30.

Last edited by baii; 28th February 2017 at 16:49.
baii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 17:14   #42778  |  Link
HillieSan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien147 View Post
I have more success with DXVA2 (native) too in general but with Madvr(and 10 bit HEVC ) I get black screen.About the judder smooth motion in Madvr doesn't go well with you?
I have same problem you have. Black screen happens with madvr since the NGU pixelart update. Previously 4K 10 bits worked fine with madvr with MPC HC/BE. With EVR (cp) I get judder in MPC BE and HC. This was always the case. But now, only potplayer seems to be smooth with EVR. Black screen with madvr. Something changed in madvr.
HillieSan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 17:33   #42779  |  Link
Damien147
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 268
I think that I've seen black screen before the version you say but back then I think that I thought that it was video issue and ignored.
Damien147 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28th February 2017, 18:12   #42780  |  Link
HillieSan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien147 View Post
I think that I've seen black screen before the version you say but back then I think that I thought that it was video issue and ignored.
What player are you using? I had issues with some players. MPC HC was the best for a long time. MPC BE had some issues. After these issues were fixed I used MPC BE a lot because it a bit was faster than MPC HC. Potplayer was also fast, but it had freezing issues. These are fixed now, I think.

I haven't updated MPC HC and now I experience black screens with madvr pixelart and 4K. In the mean time I have updated the AMD drivers a few times.
HillieSan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 16:20.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.