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Old 20th April 2010, 23:00   #7821  |  Link
Zot
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Originally Posted by jdobbs View Post
You have to be careful in your description, because "Automatic" often is two-pass mode...
You are correct :-) In this case it resulted in 1 pass but yes, I have seen 2 pass as well.

BTW - I noticed that even taking a 25GB Blu Ray movie down to AVCHD-5 STILL looks better than the same movie as a DVD on dual layer :-). You've made a great product - many thanks!

Z
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Old 20th April 2010, 23:13   #7822  |  Link
meadrocks
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Originally Posted by jdobbs View Post
You have to be careful in your description, because "Automatic" often is two-pass mode...
How do we know what settings Automatic will pick for a given movie? Can we right click on the stream & get that info?
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Old 20th April 2010, 23:38   #7823  |  Link
jdobbs
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Originally Posted by meadrocks View Post
How do we know what settings Automatic will pick for a given movie? Can we right click on the stream & get that info?
You can deselect "Automatic" and you'll see the settings that were selected. The settings aren't different for individual streams (except when you've selected "Quick Encode for Extras") -- they are set based upon the complete content of the disc that will be encoded and the space that is available for output. The bitrate, however, would change from stream to stream based upon the allocation on the original disc.
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Old 21st April 2010, 00:07   #7824  |  Link
steveg32
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Originally Posted by tandi View Post
@steveg32

i've change Change Book Type to normal, & i've use verbatim
but still get same problem ' a disc with unsupported format '
Then you should burn to BD-25 instead of BD-5/9.
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Old 21st April 2010, 00:45   #7825  |  Link
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Originally Posted by steveg32 View Post
Then you should burn to BD-25 instead of BD-5/9.
Or do movie-only to BD-5/9.
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Old 21st April 2010, 00:49   #7826  |  Link
meadrocks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdobbs View Post
You can deselect "Automatic" and you'll see the settings that were selected. The settings aren't different for individual streams (except when you've selected "Quick Encode for Extras") -- they are set based upon the complete content of the disc that will be encoded and the space that is available for output. The bitrate, however, would change from stream to stream based upon the allocation on the original disc.
I typically do Movie Only to dvd5 or dvd9. Thanks for the reply.
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Old 21st April 2010, 01:41   #7827  |  Link
kanerulz69
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Originally Posted by jdobbs View Post
You have to be careful in your description, because "Automatic" often is two-pass mode...
out of all the bd rebuilder betas i have tried only the recent one i have used automatic and i have done all 3 lord of the ring blu-rays and 2012 blu-ray (usa versions) and the automatic button did all 4 movies in 1pass mode, and i have looked at all of the final results and it seems when i use to do the movies with 2pass i can tell alot of difference in the movie, i hate that cause it really does the movie alot faster, i can start a movie at night and in the afternoon its done, and with 2 pass its about 24hrs or more, so i dunno if in time 1 pass will show the same great results as 2pass or not do you?
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Old 21st April 2010, 01:53   #7828  |  Link
jdobbs
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Originally Posted by kanerulz69 View Post
out of all the bd rebuilder betas i have tried only the recent one i have used automatic and i have done all 3 lord of the ring blu-rays and 2012 blu-ray (usa versions) and the automatic button did all 4 movies in 1pass mode, and i have looked at all of the final results and it seems when i use to do the movies with 2pass i can tell alot of difference in the movie, i hate that cause it really does the movie alot faster, i can start a movie at night and in the afternoon its done, and with 2 pass its about 24hrs or more, so i dunno if in time 1 pass will show the same great results as 2pass or not do you?
I'm still playing with settings for "Automatic" and will be tweaking it over the next few versions. In the meantime you may want to try setting the bias a little higher by using:

AUTO_BIAS=2

From the HIDDENOPTS.TXT file:

AUTO_BIAS=n -- n = 0/1/2 - Default= 1, Auto Quality bias, 0=higher speed, 1=normal, 2=higher quality

It's in the eye of the beholder -- but I personally don't see a lot of difference between one-pass and two-pass on BD-25 encodes, where it is very obvious in challenging BD-5/9 backups.

You may want to try a compromise like Good-Quality/2 pass or High-Quality/1 pass.
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Last edited by jdobbs; 21st April 2010 at 01:57.
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Old 21st April 2010, 03:34   #7829  |  Link
tandi
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@Ch3vr0n
@steveg32
my player support BD5/9, cause i have tried another title and it play smoothly in BD5, but then i try other 2 titles, got this problem
not only my player can't play it also my Bluray writer show this problem ' a disc with unsupported format '
so i mean , after i burn with imgburn, i play it in my lg bluray rom, it got this message ' a disc with unsupported format '
if play in standalone player it will reject

@jdobbs
you said ' Or do movie-only to BD-5/9. '
is it mean i only get movie only, and no menu , etc ?

Last edited by tandi; 21st April 2010 at 04:12.
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Old 21st April 2010, 04:11   #7830  |  Link
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Originally Posted by jdobbs View Post
I'm still playing with settings for "Automatic" and will be tweaking it over the next few versions. In the meantime you may want to try setting the bias a little higher by using:

AUTO_BIAS=2
Any downside to setting bias to 2? Longer encoding time or are there potential image quality trade-offs?

Thanks,

Z
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Old 21st April 2010, 04:33   #7831  |  Link
Nerz
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Originally Posted by Nerz View Post
I've have now been able to back up a number of blu-rays now. For that, thank you very much jdobbs, your work has been great. I am now only having one problem so far, my blu-rays re-encode, burn fine, from what i can tell. On my ps3 and my vizio blu-ray players the movies play and look great. Though its not a big problem but there is one blu-ray which i don't use that much anymore, bdp-s301 that will not play the bd-r25 backups. It says can't play disc, or no disc in tray. At first I ignored it because before the firmware update it said it was not bd-r compliant. The lastest firmware update did state it added this: "Compatibility with BD-R/RE discs burned by the Click to Disc™ and Click to Disc™ Editor software included with some VAIO® computers". I don't have this software but I have a hard time believing that only that software has the capabilities the record data that my blu-ray player can play. Since it's not a much used player it won't be big deal if get it working, just would be nice. Yes it does play original blu-rays
Just wondering, could it be because of LTH type discs? I'm using verbatim 2x bd-r LTH. Does anyone know if the BDP S301 supports LTH? I can get these discs for about $35 for 20. Any other mediums close in price?
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Old 21st April 2010, 05:25   #7832  |  Link
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Just wondering, could it be because of LTH type discs? I'm using verbatim 2x bd-r LTH. Does anyone know if the BDP S301 supports LTH? I can get these discs for about $35 for 20. Any other mediums close in price?
LTH doesn't work with all players. If these are Verbatim LTH, you can find a list of compatible players here:

http://www.verbatim.com/userfiles/fi...patibility.pdf

Also suggest this post should be moved as this is not a BD RB bug.
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Old 21st April 2010, 08:14   #7833  |  Link
drmih
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tandi View Post
@Ch3vr0n
@steveg32
my player support BD5/9, cause i have tried another title and it play smoothly in BD5, but then i try other 2 titles, got this problem
not only my player can't play it also my Bluray writer show this problem ' a disc with unsupported format '
so i mean , after i burn with imgburn, i play it in my lg bluray rom, it got this message ' a disc with unsupported format '
if play in standalone player it will reject

@jdobbs
you said ' Or do movie-only to BD-5/9. '
is it mean i only get movie only, and no menu , etc ?
I don't usually repost but please READ the following I said earlier:

It's quite straight forward - LG players (well the one I have) will only play compressed blu ray movies on either dvd-5 or dvd+dl if they don't have java implemented. Therefore, if there is anything in the CERTIFICATE directory (it may be there but empty) or files in the BDMV\JAR, then it won't play. It's nothing to do with settings or how you burn discs. However, if you put the files (whatever their size) on a bd-r or bd-re, then they are fine.

If you mention a title that won't play, then I'm sure one of us will confirm whether it's got java. Once again, if you play the original, and there is a point at the beginning when it has an icon or picture on the screen that either slowly changes colour, gets filled in, or does something for typically 10 to 20 seconds, then that is the java loading.

... and yes he does mean movie only and obviously this has no menu.
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Old 21st April 2010, 08:33   #7834  |  Link
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hope you's can help i'm re-ecoding 40GB saving private ryan to bd25 using the latest version of bd-rebuilder i've used the same settings all the versions of bd-rebuilder i've had for eg. i do not tick the quicker encode for extras, i always use full movie and i now use automatic quality settings.

But for some reason on this particular film its creating the image at the right size and everything but when i put in the ps3 instead of it coming up as BDMV it states AVCHD.CO.UK and the disc loads the intro but the main movie won't play.

I just wondered if anyone has come across it before its only happened since I started using the latest version.

I am also using the recommended versions of FFDSHOW,Matroska Splitter and Avisynth off your first page.

thanks guys

top product by the way Jdobbs

Last edited by graffight; 21st April 2010 at 08:43.
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Old 21st April 2010, 08:57   #7835  |  Link
deank
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Originally Posted by graffight View Post
But for some reason on this particular film its creating the image at the right size and everything but when i put in the ps3 instead of it coming up as BDMV it states AVCHD.CO.UK and the disc loads the intro but the main movie won't play.
Probably because you downloaded the movie from avchd.co.uk site.
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Old 21st April 2010, 10:56   #7836  |  Link
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I'm still playing with settings for "Automatic" and will be tweaking it over the next few versions. In the meantime you may want to try setting the bias a little higher by using:

AUTO_BIAS=2
A little confused and just looking for clarification:

AUTO_QUALITY=n n = 0/1 - Default=1?, 0=Off, 1=On (Menu Selectable)
AUTO_BIAS=n n = 0/1/2 - Default= 1, Auto Quality bias, 0=higher speed, 1=normal, 2=higher quality (From the HIDDENOPTS.TXT file)
ENCODE_QUALITY=n n = 0/1/2/3 - Default= 2, 0=Good (Very Fast), 1=Better (Fast), 2=High Quality (Default), 3=Highest (Very Slow) (Menu Selectable)
ONEPASS_ENCODING=n n=0/1 - 0=One Pass (CRF) Encoding, 1=One Pass (ABR) Encoding (Menu Selectable)

Is there a difference between AUTO_BIAS and ENCODE_QUALITY or is AUTO_BIAS an extension of ENCODE_QUALITY when having chosen AUTO_QUALITY=1?

I've noticed on sources in the 25-30GB range (e.g. "The Bad Lieutenant", "Dr. Strangelove") targeted to full disc BD9, that "Automatic" is selecting ENCODE_QUALITY=0 Good (Very Fast) and ONEPASS_ENCODING=1 (1-Pass ABR) - with "Quicker" Encode for Extras either checked or unchecked. That combination is great for speed (under 3 hrs), but marginal quality on the main movie and noticeably blocky on the smaller files. For the sake of argument, is it possible to select ENCODE_QUALITY=3 Highest (Very Slow) and ONEPASS_ENCODING=1 (1-Pass ABR) and how would AUTO_BIAS=n have an effect on that?

I'm still experimenting and have only tried a few encodes using the "Automatic" setting so far, but just trying to understand how some of the options work in conjunction with each other. I've had excellent results using 2-Pass, High Quality (Default) targeted to full disc BD9 (custom 8210 MB), but reducing the 8-10 hour encoding routine while still maintaining that level of video quality would be nice (if possible).
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Old 21st April 2010, 13:28   #7837  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Zot View Post
Any downside to setting bias to 2? Longer encoding time or are there potential image quality trade-offs?

Thanks,

Z
The threshold for selecting the next higher setting gets lowered. So on some encodes you will see longer times.
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Old 21st April 2010, 13:36   #7838  |  Link
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A little confused and just looking for clarification:

AUTO_QUALITY=n n = 0/1 - Default=1?, 0=Off, 1=On (Menu Selectable)
AUTO_BIAS=n n = 0/1/2 - Default= 1, Auto Quality bias, 0=higher speed, 1=normal, 2=higher quality (From the HIDDENOPTS.TXT file)
ENCODE_QUALITY=n n = 0/1/2/3 - Default= 2, 0=Good (Very Fast), 1=Better (Fast), 2=High Quality (Default), 3=Highest (Very Slow) (Menu Selectable)
ONEPASS_ENCODING=n n=0/1 - 0=One Pass (CRF) Encoding, 1=One Pass (ABR) Encoding (Menu Selectable)

Is there a difference between AUTO_BIAS and ENCODE_QUALITY or is AUTO_BIAS an extension of ENCODE_QUALITY when having chosen AUTO_QUALITY=1?

I've noticed on sources in the 25-30GB range (e.g. "The Bad Lieutenant", "Dr. Strangelove") targeted to full disc BD9, that "Automatic" is selecting ENCODE_QUALITY=0 Good (Very Fast) and ONEPASS_ENCODING=1 (1-Pass ABR) - with "Quicker" Encode for Extras either checked or unchecked. That combination is great for speed (under 3 hrs), but marginal quality on the main movie and noticeably blocky on the smaller files. For the sake of argument, is it possible to select ENCODE_QUALITY=3 Highest (Very Slow) and ONEPASS_ENCODING=1 (1-Pass ABR) and how would AUTO_BIAS=n have an effect on that?

I'm still experimenting and have only tried a few encodes using the "Automatic" setting so far, but just trying to understand how some of the options work in conjunction with each other. I've had excellent results using 2-Pass, High Quality (Default) targeted to full disc BD9 (custom 8210 MB), but reducing the 8-10 hour encoding routine while still maintaining that level of video quality would be nice (if possible).
Several of the settings you mentioned are not meant to be manually modified and are set by menu selections. Only the items listed in "HIDDENOPTS.TXT" are meant to be directly user modifiable.

AUTO_BIAS isn't an extension of ENCODE_QUALITY. AUTO_BIAS simply sets thresholds for when BD-RB changes settings to higher quality levels (ENCODE_QUALITY) when in "Automatic" mode (AUTO_QUALITY). You will find that there actually is a time when BD-B will select "High Quality" and One-Pass when in "Automatic" mode.

If you like using two-pass -- then use it. You just have to deselect "Automatic"..
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Last edited by jdobbs; 21st April 2010 at 13:38.
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Old 21st April 2010, 14:46   #7839  |  Link
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Several of the settings you mentioned are not meant to be manually modified and are set by menu selections. Only the items listed in "HIDDENOPTS.TXT" are meant to be directly user modifiable.

AUTO_BIAS isn't an extension of ENCODE_QUALITY. AUTO_BIAS simply sets thresholds for when BD-RB changes settings to higher quality levels (ENCODE_QUALITY) when in "Automatic" mode (AUTO_QUALITY). You will find that there actually is a time when BD-B will select "High Quality" and One-Pass when in "Automatic" mode.

If you like using two-pass -- then use it. You just have to deselect "Automatic"..
Thanks - understand manually modified vs. menu items - just wanted to make sure I understood what menu items were being translated to what specific line items in the .ini file vs. those that may be added in hiddenopts etc.

I probably have it backwards, but I would have thought that more robust encoding would be indicated in "Automatic" when compressing (if that's the right word) to a smaller space - e. g. 1-Pass ABR seems fine from all accounts going to BD25, but maybe at times not so well going to BD9. Plus, it's bypassing "Better" altogether and down to "Good" in the encoding quality calculation for the two that I mentioned. Maybe I'll give 1-Pass ABR at the "High Quality" setting a try and see how that nets out speed vs. pic quality. Yes, 2-Pass at "High Quality" has been a no-brainer for me full disc to BD9 across the board. Maybe there's no free lunch here.

BTW - for anyone that may be interested in evaluating video quality on a still frame basis (saw this in another post), you can do screen captures in VLC Media Player playing .mt2s files. I leave the output format set to .png (.jpg appears far too compressed) in preferences and use single frame advance to navigate. The time counter doesn't seem to work for .mt2s files, so you'll have to wing it to capture identical frames. I use Irfanview to quickly toggle between captures.
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Old 21st April 2010, 17:01   #7840  |  Link
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New Release of BD Rebuilder v0.33.05 (beta)

I've updated the first post of this thread with a new version of BD Rebuilder (v0.33.05). The changes for this release are:
Code:
- Corrected an error in which "?" may appear in the
  label name for certain types of non-western characters.  
  Now if a "?" is found it is replaced by "X".
- Added an new audio option under setup.  You can now
  select to reencode audio to 192Kbs 2ch AC3 audio
  rather than 5.1 AC3 (448Kbs/640Kbs).
- Made a update to the X264 command line to distinguish
  between TFF and BFF interlaced sources. In previous
  versions it was possible for a BFF source (rare) to
  be encoded as TFF and cause "jitter".
- Corrected an error in which some MPEG-2 interlaced
  sources might not be tested for pulldown or BFF flags.
- Corrected an error in which 576i sources that use
  pulldown might be incorrectly interpreted.
- Changed the default value for DEINTERLACE and added it
  to the SETUP dialog.  Now that X264 has more inclusive 
  default (non-patched) support for interlacing, BD-RB 
  will no longer deinterlace by default.  You can change
  the desired action by setting the "Use DECOMB on 
  interlaced sources" selection of the video options in 
  SETUP.
- Made a change to the AVS files generated by BD-RB so
  they don't conflict with the new interleaving added
  to X264 r1542.
- Fixed an error in the "Automatic" quality selection
  code that could have made it more likely to use 1 pass
  encoding on BD-5 encodes than was intended.
- Updated the included version of X264.EXE to the
  latest release (r1542).
- Other minor corrections and cosmetic fixes.
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