MadVR in use with LG OLED Thread

[huhn]

you have to differentiated between a panel and processing issue.

if a TV has banding with RGB but not with YCbCr input than the panel has zero to do with that all panels run RGB/WRGB. so if a panel has no banding with YCbCr it is 100% possible to do the same with RGB. it's just incompetence.

sonys RGB processing is pretty much as good as it gets that doesn't mean sony TV are even close to be perfect they have there own issue they pretty much can't do dolby vision they just pretend they can. so if you get a sony TV and want to use dolby vision content and you know about the "quality" they "handle" it than i simply have no word for you.

Panasonic has multiply issues in RGB processing is not truely "RGB" is not subsampled but it does some crazy things by using some usual patterns you can make it visible you will not notice this with real content but ohh boi...
panasonic is part of the "real cinema" group that may intentionally display a refreshrate wrong or been unable to do so correctly (PC modes makes 23p useless it was again confirmed by HDTVtest) there is no way to force a sony to to do a 3:2 pulldown.
panasonic also has a force processing issue where it has 100 levels of sharpness and up to this day i have no freaking clue what is neutral it'S between 0-50 somewhere there isn't a mode that just disables it like all the PC modes on all the other brands.

the points about to little processing power and such are just that... the majority of sony TV have 2 processor just to show you a simple way to fix it if you are unable to to something a board could do with 1/20 of the processing power of your current board.

[VBB]

Screw it all!

I'm back to my original settings from three years ago: normal HDMI mode, RGB full 8/12-bit, madVR 0-255, TV black level high. While PC mode works seemingly well with some very particular settings, several torture tests made me reconsider. As is absolutely right: anything RGB looks significantly better than 4:2:2. Chroma pattern will also show this, of course. Makes me wonder now how I used 4:2:2 for so long...

One thing I found when I reset madVR during my testing was that "colored noise" in the dithering options seems to add significant banding to 10-bit sources. Could this be a bug?

[chros]

That was quick

Originally Posted by VBB

I'm back to my original settings from three years ago: normal HDMI mode, RGB full 8/12-bit, madVR 0-255, TV black level high.

So like I use it, except for PC mode

Originally Posted by VBB

Makes me wonder now how I used 4:2:2 for so long...

Originally Posted by VBB

One thing I found when I reset madVR during my testing was that "colored noise" in the dithering options seems to add significant banding to 10-bit sources. Could this be a bug?

Is it with Ordered dithering? Which samples did you use for this test?

[QBhd]

Originally Posted by VBB

Screw it all!

I'm back to my original settings from three years ago: normal HDMI mode, RGB full 8/12-bit, madVR 0-255, TV black level high. ...

It's funny, no one listened to me long ago and I even got a little push back when I said that using YCbCr seemed wrong on many levels. Welcome back to reality, your chain above is the one I have been using ever since I watched Game of Thrones Season 8 Episode 3 "The Long Night" in HDR... this is truly a torture test for banding and sealed the deal for me with regards to the PC Mode or HDMI Mode debate. A Full RGB chain has never been a question for me

QB

[Magik Mark]

Originally Posted by VBB

Screw it all!

I'm back to my original settings from three years ago: normal HDMI mode, RGB full 8/12-bit, madVR 0-255, TV black level high. While PC mode works seemingly well with some very particular settings, several torture tests made me reconsider. As is absolutely right: anything RGB looks significantly better than 4:2:2. Chroma pattern will also show this, of course. Makes me wonder now how I used 4:2:2 for so long...

One thing I found when I reset madVR during my testing was that "colored noise" in the dithering options seems to add significant banding to 10-bit sources. Could this be a bug?

This was initial setting. My problem with this is introduces banding in Hdr. We're you able to find a work around?

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

[Asmodian]

Originally Posted by VBB

One thing I found when I reset madVR during my testing was that "colored noise" in the dithering options seems to add significant banding to 10-bit sources. Could this be a bug?

That is quite odd. I always disable colored noise because it looks weird to me. I expect it is more an artifact of the less than perfect 10 bit processing. Trying to figure out good settings for the W, R, G, and B subpixels when neighboring pixels have totally different hues is probably tricky.

That is something to remember, these TVs cannot do native RGB color like a normal display. Theoretically they could do pixel accurate rendering but the panels exhibit some artifacts that make me think you do have to consider the state of the surrounding pixels when setting voltages for subpixels (crosstalk is an issue). I don't know how they mix the white pixel in but the display will have to do more sophisticated / different image processing than one with proper RGB subpixels, with any input format.

[VBB]

@chros - I don't know how you use PC mode with that combo, especially after reading all your posts here and at AVS . PC mode is definitely useable with RGB full 8-bit, black level low, though. I always use ordered dithering, yeah. I could clearly see the banding added by "colored noise" in the S&M rotating ramps 8/10-bit pattern. The 10-bit side is usually perfectly smooth, and in this case it looked exactly like the 8-bit side. I was able to reproduce this several times. Weird.

@QBhd - I have always been a been a true believer in a full RGB chain, but for a while I was after the best possible banding scenario. And I don't know if it was the latest Nvidia driver that changed something, but after my five days of testing, I have to say that RGB never looked this good before. It used to show way more banding than YCbCr, or at least that's how I remember it

@Magic Mark - Are you talking about normal HDMI mode or PC mode? In normal mode you should not see any obvious banding with the RGB full chain. We're not talking about games here, are we?

@Asmodian - Same here. I have both dithering options disabled, and I would have never noticed this if it hadn't been for the reset.

[quietvoid]

Always had slight color banding in madVR over to the C8, mostly in shadows (hair line, jaw lines). Will definitely try disabling colored noise.

[Magik Mark]

@VBB Oops. I had my black level set to low. Now is ok.

May I ask do you still use 8bit or 10bit in madvr?

[VBB]

I switched back to 10-bit, because I ended up using RGB full 12-bit for the lower refresh rates. Don't forget to also change madVR back to 0-255, if you use black level HIGH.

[Magik Mark]

Originally Posted by VBB

I switched back to 10-bit, because I ended up using RGB full 12-bit for the lower refresh rates. Don't forget to also change madVR back to 0-255, if you use black level HIGH.

I'm using 4k 60hz 8bit in GPU. Is 10bit in madvr still advisable?

[VBB]

If your entire chain is 8-bit and does not switch to something greater at the lower rates, then I would advise to set madVR to 8-bit.

[Magik Mark]

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

[Magik Mark]

Does anybody know if you will get HDMI 2.1 features using PCI 3 interface?

[SamuriHL]

They have nothing to do with each other. The answer is yes.

[Magik Mark]

Glad to know that. I thought I'll be needing a new MOBO with PCIE 4 support

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

[Asmodian]

Apparently LG fixed their 120 Hz issues on the CX with firmware 03.11.25. Now there is no chroma subsampling in PC mode at 120 Hz.

I was worried it wasn't going to be an easy fix.

[scooterlord]

Hello from me again. Long time since I've last commented in this forum - although I've been silently lurking around

So I got my LG CX OLED this week, and I've been having some issues with the colors, etc. So, taking the suggestions in this thread under consideration I ended up with the following settings, but have some issues I want help with.

- On the TV I have set HDR - Standard (yep, not cinema), more or less all options close to defaults (demos are looking gorgeous!)
- Windows 10 w/ HDR enabled, RGB, 12-Bit, Full color, 23Hz

Most of the content I am going to see is h265, 10-bit, HDR. Using Potplayer with MadVR - the settings for my content that suit best require some processing, so I am using the following settings:
- Reduce banding artifacts med, med,
- Reduce random noise

My pc can handle it - i5 9600kf w/2060 RTX Super. Th problem is that this processing pushes GPU utilization to ~55% - essentially this means that it turns the fans on, which is annoying.
Switching to FFMpeg decoder, quality looks more or less the same, with ~5% GPU utilization and ~10% CPU utilization, which is ideal... EXCEPT the colors. Which make a huge difference! It's like HDR is not utilized at all or something. Tried all kinds of video renders but the result can only get worse that EVR.

Coming to questions:
- Is there a way to force MadVR do its processing on the CPU? Or was it not designed for such cases?
- What could be the issue for the huge difference in colors when using MadVR? Is it doing something special about the colors that I could most likely fake with a software decoder? Any suggestions or pointers on where to look?

Thanks!

[VBB]

@As - Have you installed the new firmware yet? If so, how does it look now as far as chroma, and does it look any better at 120Hz than at 60Hz or lower (in PC mode), especially when it comes to banding?

[Asmodian]

Sorry for the slow response. Yes, I have installed 03.11.25 on my LG CX.

For PC mode:
Chroma is perfect now, no chroma artifacts at all with ChromaRes.png. I am very happy with 4K120 Hz PC mode, at least I never expected it to be better than it is now. 120 Hz is better than 60 Hz in all ways.

With 10 bit out from madVR posterization is still noticeably worse, I tested 8 bit full range RGB. I think 120 Hz has less posterization in the midrange and perhaps near black as well but it seems a little softer rather than actually fewer bands, or maybe only slightly fewer. I wasn't expecting to see a difference. I especially noticed an improvement with very dim pixels becoming slightly less dim, at 60 Hz this can make a bright artifact line that moves with the gradient but disappears if the pattern is paused. At 120 Hz it doesn't seem to be an issue. That was the most annoying artifact for me with full range input and dithering to limited range YCbCr would mitigate it in a similar way. Switching back and forth is a bit annoying with the CAC-1085 due to needing to power cycle it so take all this as tentative. I did switch back and forth a lot but there was always some time between and I knew if it was 60 or 120 Hz, etc.

Oddly I don't seem to be able to send YCbCr 444 120 Hz to the CAC-1085 using driver 456.71 and a 2080 Ti.