madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[SamuriHL]

It is. And beyond that if he ever adds the look ahead to the realtime (where it reads a few frames in advance) then the realtime will have the same benefit in reality of the measurement file.

[juffi]

I have tried to get 3D MVC working with GTX 1650. Looks like madVR is broken with 3D MVC and Madshi has said there may be a fix coming. What is the current status? Is there any test available?

[seiyafan]

On a 1440p monitor, which of the these two gives better quality? upscale from 1080 or downscale from 4k?

[Klaus1189]

Oversampling is superior but it depends on your sources. If you have "only" 1080p sources then it will be better to upscale 1080p to 1440p because you can't downscacle from 2160p

[Alexkral]

Why not? He's asking which one would give better quality, so I assume he has both sources. I would say it's the other way around, a sharp downscaler like catrom would find its way to keep some details that are present in the 2160p source, but in the 1080p source just don't exist.

[huhn]

he defined "oversampling".

ignoring source issues downscaling should be generally better but make sure you are using SSIM other scaler in madVR are not up to the task because it's missing a crucial feature for these scaler.

[tp4tissue]

Originally Posted by seiyafan

On a 1440p monitor, which of the these two gives better quality? upscale from 1080 or downscale from 4k?

The 4k is superior in all cases under all circumstances.

Videos are stored in 4:2:0 chroma subsampled formats.

1080p videos only have 960x540 color resolution. Right there you lose a bunch of texture detail.

Then most 1080p vids are h264, which means you lose another ~30% detail vs similar bitrate h265 files.

Then of course, 4K has 4x the luma resolution.

Then there's 10bit, which again improves texture fidelity and gradients.

[HillieSan]

This make me think. I have a JVC X5000 with e-shift to 4K. Currently, I use NGU sharp with e-shift and e-shift makes the sharpness a bit softer. The result is good.

Would upscaling to 4K and downscaling to native 1080p a better option than using e-shift 4K?

[Klaus1189]

Good question, I don't know. Here is a video, I know it is german only, but I added a timestamp, where you can compare 4 different screenshots regarding socalled "4K". They were allowed to put 4K logo on it because the spec only says pixel in width which is fine.
eshift is far away from native 4K

[HillieSan]

Thanks for the video. I understand German quite well.

In my opinion the eshift 4K is better than Full HD in detail but makes the image a bit softer. Of course eshift is not true 4K. NGU sharp with eshift gives me good results at the distance of 3 meters.

HDR passthrough works better than tonemapping for most movies (HDR->HDR). For some other movies it is the reverse where tonemapping improves a lot (HDR->HDR). I have noticed that when changing the HDR passthrough/tonemapping settings, the Apply button is not working well. It has trouble to restore the full colors for HDR passthrough. It was like tonemapping was always better than HDR passthrough, which was false. I had to restart the player every time I change the setting to HDR passthrough. There are many variables I have played with, so perhaps I did something wrong.

[huhn]

e shift is real 4K they can show an image with alternating pixel at 4K even with chroma. is native resolution better yes but that's not the topic here.
in the end e shift works similar to CRT and crts have a resolution over 1 pixel don't they?
BTW. the fact that they say "du must das ja ihrgeht wo hin schieben aber es gibt ja gakeine freie fläche" they really don't have a clue how e shift works?

about 1080p at 1080p with e shift. on AVS they claim 4k is better here but i can clearly see a point for 1080p here i guess you should try it.

[Manni]

Originally Posted by huhn

e shift is real 4K they can show an image with alternating pixel at 4K even with chroma. is native resolution better yes but that's not the topic here.
in the end e shift works similar to CRT and crts have a resolution over 1 pixel don't they?
BTW. the fact that they say "du must das ja ihrgeht wo hin schieben aber es gibt ja gakeine freie fläche" they really don't have a clue how e shift works?

about 1080p at 1080p with e shift. on AVS they claim 4k is better here but i can clearly see a point for 1080p here i guess you should try it.

e-shift isn't 4K with the JVCs, it's about 3K.

It takes 4K content (or 1080p if it upscales), splits each 2160p frame into two 1080p subframes, then displays each 1080p subframes shifted temporally half a pixel to the left and half a pixel up (or similar) to increase perceived resolution.

You would need four 1080p subframes from each 2160p frame, not two, to get 4K with e-shift, but then you hit refresh rate issues, as displaying 4 subframes within one frame is harder that displaying two, especially at 60p, as you'd need 240hz instead of 120hz.

Some DLPs have real 4K resolution with eshift, but the JVCs don't.

Native 4K is definitely better than 1080p e-shift, at least on the JVCs. Clearly visible on patterns and with real content.

I had an X7000 (rs500) e-shift and I have now an NX7 (RS2000), there is no contest.

[huhn]

ok i try to remember that JVC doesn't do it correctly.
even cheap one in 2020 talk about 4x.
there are also mirrors with a different resolution like 2160x1920 which only need 2 images.

[HillieSan]

The JVC NX5 is native 4K and goes for €5999. I bought the X5000 new for €3500 at the time. What I like about this X5000 is that I see no grid, great black levels and HDR support (I had a DLP Sharp Z200E before). Perhaps after 5 years I will buy a new 4K with 8K eshift JVC :-) But for now the X5000 will do fine. NGU sharp very high improves the image of the X5000 with eshift.

A long time ago I used bluesky to interpolate the images on 60Hz and it significantly improved the images, but NGU could not be used (judder). I want to try this first with a RTX 3060 Ti.

[huhn]

my comment was more about how projectors are still making good progress. the nx5 is a bit older than 2020.

neither the 5700 xt nor nvidia GPU support bluesky the same should be true for the 6000 series.

[HillieSan]

I will also look into SVP and madvr smooth motion.

[huhn]

madVR smoothmotion is unrelated to SVP or bluesky.

[70MM]

Originally Posted by Asmodian

if (deintfps < 24.5) AND (srcWidth <= 1050) and (srcHeight <= 768) "SD 24fps"
if (deintfps < 25.5) AND (srcWidth <= 1050) and (srcHeight <= 768) "SD 25fps"
if (deintfps < 61) AND (srcWidth <= 1050) and (srcHeight <= 768) "SD 60fps"
if (deintfps < 24.5) AND (HDR) "HDR 24fps"
if (deintfps < 25.5) AND (HDR) "HDR 25fps"
if (HDR) "HDR 60fps"
if (deintfps < 24.5) "HD 24fps"
if (deintfps < 25.5) "HD 25fps"
else "HD 60fps"

Asmodian you helped me write this script and I must admit its been absolutely amazing for me using my 1080Ti card on the higher madvr settings. However over the last few days Ive run into problems with 24 material thats 720 and not my normal 1080 files. As I use the highest settings on 24 1080 files, when a 720 file is played Im dropping frames like crazy! I need to have a script with lower settings for the 720 files to stop the dropped frames....

Can you help me again please to address the 720 files say at 24, 25 and 60 please? Is script added to the 24 section or does something seperate have to be written?

Thank you in advance...

[huhn]

setting the SD 24/25/60 profile to luma quadruple to disable or a lower NGU setting should do the trick.

[70MM]

Thank you hunn, do you mean I disable Luma Quadrupling as at the moment its "let madvr decide"?
Is this not used at all on 1080 material?