Encoding 4K HDR 4:2:0 10bit BT.2020 (continuation)

[Groucho2004]

Rule 14) Multiple registrations are prohibited and are grounds for immediate account deletion.

Any mods around to kick this dimwit out? Just in case anyone missed it, this is his alter ego.

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by Groucho2004

Any mods around to kick this dimwit out? Just in case anyone missed it, this is his alter ego.

Do you encode in HDR? I'm visionplushdr. What are you talking about?

Can you show something of your work in HDR grading, or you are another guy with nothing to show?

Where is the rule for the users with nothing to show which offtopic an entire thread with garbage?

I believe there should have been a rule for that, and you should be banned among the rest of the kids with the HDR software ridiculous images without thumbnails.

[Groucho2004]

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

Do you encode in HDR?

No.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

I'm visionplushdr.

There may be a cure for that.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

What are you talking about?

Rule 14, try to read my post again.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

Where is the rule for the users with nothing to show which offtopic an entire thread with garbage?

42

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

you should be banned among the rest of the kids with the HDR software ridiculous images without thumbnails.

You kinda lost it there, drifting off into unintelligible drivel...

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by Groucho2004

No.


There may be a cure for that.

Rule 14, try to read my post again.

42

You kinda lost it there, drifting off into unintelligible drivel...

Yes you are kinda lost.

Then rule 42? You are filling the thread with garbage and you don't even do HDR. Double problem.

You are also trolling now.

May i ask how old are you? I see you everytime posting offtopics and warning mods with no arguments, you also post inside topics you have no knowledge or interest.

You also post thinking you sound smarter than others. Behavior like yours is exactly the opposite as an intelligent person. Just a heads up.

[Groucho2004]

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

Yes you are kinda lost.

I do sometimes feel lost. However, not today.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

you don't even do HDR

Well, I'm straight.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

You are also trolling now.

Just a bit, it's very tempting when you're around.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

May i ask how old are you?

No, you may not.

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

You also post thinking you sound smarter than others.

Really? If that is the case, it's certainly unintentional. Maybe you're simply not used to someone having a reasonable command of the English language?

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by Groucho2004

I do sometimes feel lost. However, not today.


Well, I'm straight.

Just a bit, it's very tempting when you're around.

No, you may not.

Really? If that is the case, it's certainly unintentional. Maybe you're simply not used to someone having a reasonable command of the English language?

Do you realize you are the one devastating the topic, right?

I wonder how you don't get banned when you even argue about people like me that only shows just work and you are here trolling, doing offtopic and you don't even encode anything at all. I have doubts you even know how to encode a video in full hd properly.

Let's get you in the right place: You are the one trolling and messing up the thread. Not me, you can continue to troll the whole topic then later people and moderators will know who is the problem here.

Following your trolling comes the other users that likes garbage filled inside topics, just for fun like you just said " i troll when you are here " . Then who is the problem, you or me?

[visionplushdr]

Anyway, i will avoid the kids.

Here's a screenshot in 1000 nits and DCI-P3.



I will throw more images later in different scenes.

This is a movie from 1989, the movie source got a heavy noise ( not only film grain ) on it that's why was hard to achieve a good HDR grade.

Present ringing on image is from MadVR resizers. Image is being upscaled to 4K.

[Groucho2004]

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

Do you realize you are the one devastating the topic, right?

Do you realize that everyone who replied to you in this topic is making fun of you or doesn't care about your bullshit? Do you really think that people don't know that you're posting with multiple accounts? How retarded are you?

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by Groucho2004

Do you realize that everyone who replied to you in this topic is making fun of you or doesn't care about your bullshit? Do you really think that people don't know that you're posting with multiple accounts? How retarded are you?

No i don't care because nobody here does HDR so far as i know, nobody is showing anything.
And one guy doesn't even knows what is HDR either. Why i would care? You are so small brain gifted that you care about such things?

I show my work and if you believe it's bullshit then argument on why it's bullshit. I can throw image comparisons against the source to get you shut up and place a warning on how to behalf in the future.

You don't know to grade in HDR. You can't even critic anything on here. You only feel good by trolling me because it's the only thing you can do on here.

I believe you have issues and a lot.

Like i said, i will continue to show the HDR grading i do. Some people ( A LOT, thousands ) loves what i do, 3 or 4 trolls from here are not the world, did you know that?

Thousands of people ( i mean, more than 10.000 ) watched my work and every single people liked it, and that's because nobody else is doing this.

If you don't know what to do on here but trolling then go and create a topic called Groncho Trolling Thread. You may get to know people like you and feel better.

[kolak]

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

Thousands of people ( i mean, more than 10.000 ) watched my work and every single people liked it, and that's because nobody else is doing this.

If you don't know what to do on here but trolling then go and create a topic called Groncho Trolling Thread. You may get to know people like you and feel better.

Watched on illegal site, where you are charging money to watch your crap HDR made of ripped Blu-rays etc?

ups sorry, I assume you realised that you may get in big trouble and now you don't charge. Why are you not doing it anymore, scared?
Instead your web if full of adverts and some crappy links to some scams.

Your website is a joke- "Real 4K content, Rec.2020" etc etc. You, master of HDR content sell people this crap knowing that all your work comes from Rec.709 masters and it's far from REAL HDR content.

Already told you- buy/rent a good camera, go shoot something, grade yourself and then come back and show us what you have created. Ripping Blu-rays and making HDR version from them is nothing to shout about Get real, if you have skill get a job where you can use them and earn money from it.

Do you really don't get it that no one here is interested in your next and next grab of some fake HDR?

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by kolak

Watched on illegal site, where you are charging money to watch your crap HDR made of ripped Blu-rays etc?

ups sorry, I assume you realised that you may get in big trouble and now you don't charge. Why are you not doing it anymore, scared?
Instead your web if full of adverts and some crappy links to some scams.

Already told you- buy/rent a good camera, go shoot something, grade yourself and then come back and show us what you have created. Ripping blu-ray and making HDR version from them is nothing to shout about Get real, if you have skill get a job where you can use them and earn money from it.

What scams and what charges? Donations are not a charge. How torrent are illegal? In UK court is even legal now downloading movies. The site you mention is not even hosted in USA. Also what about Popcorn time?

How an HDR grade in torrent that doesn't even exists can be illegal? Movies with no HDR commercial version hosted worldwide in your computer as well, since you have downloaded it as you claim. Then you are in trouble?

Now let's move to the technical aspects.

You don't know how to grade a movie to HDR and that's why you keep on saying it's not proper grading. It looks fine and you can't even argument on why it doesn't looks good to you.

Compared to the SDR Blu-Ray it has HDR, deep blacks, expanded gamut, highlights and it's even native.

Picture is better than SDR version, in any field. So what's wrong with you?

You claim movies must be graded from a "master" and you have never seen such. Studios upscales from 2K and sells "4K". Where's the master there? If they use proper master, movie can easily transferred to full native 4K resolution but hey... it doesn't happens with most of the movies.

Prove me and the rest of the people the transfers i do looks worse than the SDR Version. And prove are not "proper" HDR because... argument on it.

And there's no such thing as fake HDR. It's HDR or it's not. You really have no idea on HDR at all.

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by kolak

Your website is a joke- "Real 4K content, Rec.2020" etc etc. You, master of HDR content sell people this crap knowing that all your work comes from Rec.709 masters and it's far from REAL HDR content.

Prove that claim then. "Real HDR content" looks better. Prove it then.

Your claims needs some support or are just instant ignorance.

[kolak]

If you rip Blu-ray and use it for your own "pleasure" that's sort of fine. If you then take it, make fake HDR version and ask people to pay money to see it on your website, then this is a serious crime.

Why have you stopped charging for access to your website?

If studios sell upscaled content they are in most cases get "punished" for it. People now are more aware what is real/good and what crap and they talk about it. There were many case with BDs being re-done due to people's complain.

This should be on your website: "I rip Blu-rays, make fake HDR of them and try to make money on it, by lying that it's real HDR content. I don't care about content owners as law in my country allows for illegal distribution and copy"

Yes, in some way there is no real or fake HDR, but it's a different story if you make one from RAW assets, compared to some "up conversion".

Can you take SD content and make nice HD of it?

[kolak]

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

Prove that claim then. "Real HDR content" looks better. Prove it then.

Your claims needs some support or are just instant ignorance.

Go to NAB or IBC show then at least you will be able to see HDR on good monitors.

One thing- have you upgrade madVR- it has improved algorithms so your HDR may look even better then before, as you rely a lot on madVR processing

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by kolak

If you rip Blu-ray and use it for your own "pleasure" that's sort of fine. If you then take it, make fake HDR version and ask people to pay money to see it on your website, then this is a serious crime.

Why have you stopped charging for access to your website?

If studios sell upscaled content they are in most cases get "punished" for it. People now are more aware what is real/good and what crap and they talk about. There were many case with BDs being re-done due to people's complain.

This should be on your website: "I rip Blu-rays, make fake HDR of them and try to make money on it, by lying that it's real HDR content. I don't care about content owners as law in my current allows for illegal distribution and copying"

I have never charged anything for any movie. And i do the movies for myself, people started to like the samples on youtube and other forums where shown, then huge portals talked with me to allow public to get it.

The "scams" were just a system to allow the site to be running as it costs money to host such site. And are not scams just surveys or contests. You really have no idea on anything at all, right?

And there's no fake HDR. And i don't rip any blu-rays either. I own the blu-rays, you can't do an HDR grade from a ripped movie.

Blu-Rays are really high bitrate in AVC and works fine for most of the movies, the ones with film grain can also be graded like Indiana Jones.

You confuse quality of source with colorspace as well. The 10-bit from your "masters" are just to do an easier HDR grade and gamut expand, with no dither processing which results in an easy to do HDR grade.

Dithered image to 10-bit ( well dithered ) can look as good as a native 10-bit to the eyes.

You confuse a lot of things because you don't know how HDR grading in movie industry is made.

It's not made with Davinci or Adobe Premiere either. It's not mandatory to grade HDR from a 10 or 12 bit source either. HDR grade can be done from any source. HDR is a process also made on images. You can do HDR to anything you want.

Your proper and real HDR grade doesn't exists, it's just what you believe is HDR in video.

Here's Indiana Jones the tank scene in 1400 nits output DCI-P3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3vd6V35-L4

Same scene from the SDR blu-ray:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tGDSAs_uU4

Now please argument with your technical aspects why it's a fake HDR. I honestly laugh a lot when i read such thing "fake HDR".

That video is in 1400 nits and you can setup up to 10.000 where you get higher range.

Argument like a man not like a kid now.

[kolak]

It's fake in the same sense how 2K master upscaled to 4K is fake, which are your words. You can't interpolate data from Rec.709 gamut to P3. It will never be as good as making P3 grade from RAW assets which "hold" way more colors.

If you were doing SDR from HDR with some cool algorithm then fine- this could work well, but not other way around.

Rec.709 master will have tons of data lost compared to Raw assets which master was made from and there is not a single algorithm in the world which is able to recover them. You perfectly know this. This is why you will never be able to match "real" HDR master which studios can do by going to Raw assets. It's as simple as source assets limitation problem.

No, you can't make HD master (from SD version) looking as good as original and the same applies to your work. It always going to be quite big compromise. Doing good job with what you have? Fine, but stop claiming some superiority etc. Also- note the you mainly compare your work to SDR, not HDR made by others. HDR will look better, as high brightness stimulates eye differently and old Rec.709 and 100nits standard is very outdated. We know this, that's why there is HDR. Technology improved, so time has come to give people something better even at home. It's driven by money as everything in the world, so again- you did not discover anything new here.

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by kolak

It's fake in the same sense how 2K master upscaled to 4K is fake, which are your words. You can't interpolate data from Rec.709 gamut to P3. It will never be as good as making P3 grade from RAW assets which "hold" way more colors.

If you were doing SDR from HDR with some cool algorithm then fine- this could work well, but not other way around.

Rec.709 master will have tons of data lost compared to Raw assets which master was made from and there is not a single algorithm in the world which is able to recover them. You perfectly know this. This is why you will never be able to match "real" HDR master which studios can do by going to Raw assets. It's as simple as source assets limitation.

Again you have no idea and you post like you know what you are posting.

Argument on why it's fake in the looks my friend not on your confused brain. Stop listening to your confused brain and argument on the LOOKS OF THE MOVIE.

Does it have HDR?

• Deeper blacks - Checked.
• Expanded Gamut - Checked.
• Better Highlights - Checked.
• Expanded Gamma Curve *PQ - Checked.
• More movie details - Checked.
• It's native HDR HEVC ST. 2084 / 2020 grade - Checked.

In the looks compared to the SDR blu-ray version, how the SDR version looks like?

Movies are meant to be watched. HDR is meant to be better picture. Did you know that?

Rec. 709 can be HDR. 2020 is the expanded range/colorspace. For the expanded PQ curve which peaks in 10.000 nits. Where you can grade up to it.

Rec. 709 got a limited palette that can be also expanded with several methods. Technicolor is one.

I believe you have no idea and you can't argument on why it looks bad or "fake". Colors are also a lot better. So where's the problen with the 709 source here?

[kolak]

Originally Posted by visionplushdr

I believe you have no idea and you can't argument on why it looks bad or "fake". Colors are also a lot better. So where's the problen with the 709 source here?

Because studio (or you if had access) can take RAW assets and make master which will be way better than yours as their assets hold tons of more usable data. They have access to huge gamut, high bit depth, can push things a lot in any direction. They have massive possibilities, to tweak it as their assets will let them do it. You, with just 8bit BD source, are very restricted and nothing what you can do about it.

You know this, but yet refuse to acknowledge. Again- I will give you just DVD and ask to make best possible HD master from it. Then I will reveal HD version of it and prove that your upscaled version is crap.

I could point you to some EXR Alexa footage which was shot with dual exposure, so holds about 18 real stops of dynamic range. This is something which would let you to play a lot and also do your own creative grading. It was shot by German uni to do study on HDR.

[visionplushdr]

Originally Posted by kolak

Because studio can take RAW assets and make master which will be way better than yours as their assets hold tons of more usable data. They have access to huge gamut, high bit depth, can push things a lot in any direction. They have massive possibilities, to tweak it as their assets will let them do it. You, with just 8bit BD source, are very restricted and nothing what you can do about it.

You know this, but yet refuse to acknowledge.

I could point you to some EXR Alexa footage which was shot with dual exposure, so holds about real 18 stops of dynamic range. This is something which would let you to play a lot and also do your own creative grading. It was shot by German uni to do study on HDR.

For sure, but having a higher quality source doesn't instantly makes a better HDR grade. Because people grades it not robots or meta-humans.

HDR10 is crap for example, you can have the best source in the world and when graded to HDR10, the result is horrible. Why? poor nits grade and colorspace doesn't even gets favored by the quality source.

Dolby Vision movies looks a lot better, why? Higher grade. Higher nits output helped by TV different processings to expand levels on lower nits panels from today ( image is changed, not native HDR either here ).

Now, let's say you have a high quality source and groncho grades it to HDR. How it will look like?

And another, you can get a 709 source and make it look better than a crappy HDR grade from a movie studio with a higher quality source, because even Disney screws up colors on their movies. So?


HDR grading is art. It's never fake and it's never perfect. Because people grades it and it depends on how they grade and what sort of methods they use to bring life to the High Dynamic Range version of the movie. Every movie in HDR looks different,a lot of commercial movies in HDR looks like crap.

Originally Posted by kolak

You know this, but yet refuse to acknowledge. Again- I will give you just DVD and ask to make best possible HD master from it. Then I will reveal HD version of it and prove that your upscaled version is crap.

Upscaling has nothing to do with HDR Grading. Upscale is creating pixels where they are not even exists. HDR Grading is completely other thing.

Now with the 4K, a lot of commercial movies being named as 4K are 2K bilinear upscales which looks horrible as well.

Did you understand the whole point?

[kolak]

Send me 1 sec of some nice HDR scene from your file (original h265, not converted to anything).