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Old 4th April 2014, 01:55   #25641  |  Link
leeperry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
my GTX 660
I just experienced my first random white pixels veil due to overheating on my 7850 huh(the 20% fan speed cap apparently has its limits), all was well until I tried NNEDI 32x for chroma and things went bananas...2:30AM is way too late for me to compare it against J3AR anyway

All this said, your Asus 660 has become a benchmark when it comes to silence...can it do the following on 1280x720@24 please?

Chroma: J3AR(possible NNEDI 32x)
Image Up: J3AR
Image Down: CR+AR+LL
NNEDI 64x luma doubling
low debanding
A4 mono-static LL dithering
PS script on top of it

I realize that the 660 scores poorly in pure OCL benchmarks but the AMD interop lag divides the results in outrageous proportions and your 660's silence blew me away while I briefly owned it
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Old 4th April 2014, 04:12   #25642  |  Link
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Just reporting in to say the OpenCL registry tweak does the trick for my HD 4000 / GT 650M.

Now I have the option for 480p23 -> 1080p to go Jinc3+AR or NNEDI3 16 neurons doubling+Lanczos3+AR. More intensive, and rendering times are too high. Hrms. Choices, choices. Both are good ones, fortunately.
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Old 4th April 2014, 04:40   #25643  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi
madVR v0.87.9
Thank You !!!
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Old 4th April 2014, 10:46   #25644  |  Link
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I think I found a pretty serious bug.

Setup:
Windows 8.1
madVR 0.87.9
MPC-HC 1.7.3.185
Nvidia 335.23
ReClock 1.8.8.3
Xy-SubFilter 3.1.0.687

MadVR Settings:
Debanding low, NNEDI3 32 chroma, NNEDI3 32 luma doubling, Jinc 3 upscaling, CR AA LL downscaling
FSE, Seperate device for presentation, queues 24/20/16, SM FRC 'only if judder'
ED option 2, colored noise, change every frame
No trade for quality options checked.

Issue:
Playing back content not in native aspect ratio of monitor plays content outside monitor resolution. In other words, rendering / upscaling larger than monitor supports, cutting subtitles and picture detail. Not fully fitting the image inside the resolution. I have a 2560x1440 (16:9 aspect ratio) monitor.

Examples playing SD content. (4:3 and other, not natively 16:9) Had to disable FSE mode to take screenshots.


Native 16:9 content upscales fine and doesn't have this issue. Here are two examples with 720p and 1080p images to 1440p.


I apologize, I do not know when this bug began to occur, as I only recently began watching older SD content. I do know I never use to have this issue about 8 months back.

Is there a way to force target rectangle to monitor's resolution so content can maintain aspect ratio inside display's aspect ratio to avoid stretching and displaying 'out of bounds', losing detail?
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Old 4th April 2014, 11:10   #25645  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Are you sure you didn't mess with your player settings to cause this?
For example, MPC-HC should be set to Video Frame -> "Touch from inside" and "Keep Aspect Ratio", as well as Pan&Scan should be off (use "Reset" to clear any settings).
Sounds to me like you have it set to "Touch from outside" instead.
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Old 4th April 2014, 11:36   #25646  |  Link
octal9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
madshi, is there still reason to keep the old FSE path?
for people like me with crap gpu's and not much (or any) expendable income (i.e.: me). fse provides much more stable performance with far less frame drops/presentation glitches (at least on my rig) - currently running an ancient geforce 8400gs on windows 7 64bit and can play back even high bitrate blu ray encodes beautifully (albeit with mostly the lowest settings). thanks a trillion times over to madshi!
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Old 4th April 2014, 11:42   #25647  |  Link
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DXVA decoding and subtitles in XP

Is it possible with Madvr?
If possible how?
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Old 4th April 2014, 11:55   #25648  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Originally Posted by toniash View Post
Is it possible with Madvr?
If possible how?
Only DXVA2 is supported by madVR, which generally requires Windows Vista or newer.
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Old 4th April 2014, 12:16   #25649  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blu3wh0 View Post
I would like to note that I'm getting the same issue as DragonQ with AMD 7950 x2. At first I thought I was crazy since most other people with AMD video cards seem to be getting at least some respectable luma doubling, thinking it might be a problem with my setup. I have tried everything that I could think of to try to fix this to no avail.

My OpenCL copy and kernel fps drops from approximately 5250 fps to 130 fps with the interop. I'm on Windows 8.1 x64 and running the latest AMD beta driver. OpenCl error diffusion used to give me the same problem before madshi switched it to DirectCompute. The lowest frame time I can get with luma doubling at 16 neurons for a 720p 24 fps file is 48-50 ms with everything else either disabled or the lowest possible settings. My GPU runs at approximately 40% when I try to use my current settings with luma doubling.

Sorry if this is kind of abrupt, I have been following madVR and lurking here since madshi started developing it, to which I cannot express my gratitude enough in words (for now, thank you!), but I have been pulling my hair out due to this problem. Please let me know if I can provide any other kind of info.
Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
pci-e 2.0 x8 is like using pci-e 1.1 and this is to slow for nnedi on amd. i hope amd fix this in the future.
At least in your case it looks like there's an explanation!
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Old 4th April 2014, 12:48   #25650  |  Link
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I still can't get my head around how 4 GB/s is limiting the performance of the video card when using NNEDI. It must be a very poor/slow implementation on AMD's part for the OpenCL/Direct3D interop, an issue they apparently don't have when it is DirectCompute/Direct3D. At least I can still watch DVD/480p content using luma doubling/quadrupling, where it makes a bigger difference. Since my computer is relatively modern and high spec, I never thought I would run into an issue like this I just don't see AMD fixing this any time soon, if ever.
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Old 4th April 2014, 13:06   #25651  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blu3wh0 View Post
I still can't get my head around how 4 GB/s is limiting the performance of the video card when using NNEDI. It must be a very poor/slow implementation on AMD's part for the OpenCL/Direct3D interop, an issue they apparently don't have when it is DirectCompute/Direct3D. At least I can still watch DVD/480p content using luma doubling/quadrupling, where it makes a bigger difference. Since my computer is relatively modern and high spec, I never thought I would run into an issue like this I just don't see AMD fixing this any time soon, if ever.
it looks like amd didn't have a interop for D3D <-> OpenCl it looks like it goes over the cpu else the pci-e speed wouldn't matter at all for this.
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Old 4th April 2014, 13:46   #25652  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
it looks like amd didn't have a interop for D3D <-> OpenCl it looks like it goes over the cpu else the pci-e speed wouldn't matter at all for this.
If that is what is actually happening then it sounds like it goes through some emulation layer or something. A very bad idea/implementation for their part.
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Old 4th April 2014, 14:20   #25653  |  Link
leeperry
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
it looks like amd didn't have a interop for D3D <-> OpenCl it looks like it goes over the cpu else the pci-e speed wouldn't matter at all for this.
What's even more obvious is that we're throwing money out the window when the real-world yield fps rate is so low....whatever power consumption or graphic card price-wise. Should the interop be a non-issue even the lowest grade AMD boards would be NNEDI monsters, possibly with passive cooling too

So how do 660's score with NNEDI then? Anyone's with a 660 around please?

Last edited by leeperry; 4th April 2014 at 14:37.
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Old 4th April 2014, 16:15   #25654  |  Link
SecurityBunny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
Are you sure you didn't mess with your player settings to cause this?
For example, MPC-HC should be set to Video Frame -> "Touch from inside" and "Keep Aspect Ratio", as well as Pan&Scan should be off (use "Reset" to clear any settings).
Sounds to me like you have it set to "Touch from outside" instead.
Thank you so much! I don't believe I've changed any settings and can't find any in options menu. However, I hit reset, disabled lav decoding again, re-enabled madvr (and the such) and it all displays properly now! I must have hit a shortcut key if one exists.
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Old 4th April 2014, 19:36   #25655  |  Link
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has the OpenCL rendering dialog moved to general settings? (use OpenCL to process DXVY NV12 surfaces)
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Old 4th April 2014, 20:05   #25656  |  Link
michkrol
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Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8 View Post
has the OpenCL rendering dialog moved to general settings? (use OpenCL to process DXVY NV12 surfaces)
Not sure what you mean, but it has nothing to do with NNEDI scaling/doubling (which uses OpenCL).
This option is only used if you're using DXVA Native decoding. It speeds up rendering in some cases.
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Old 4th April 2014, 20:38   #25657  |  Link
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63 nerons and 720p, or 32 neurons and 1080p?

NNEDI3 behaves strangely depending on the neuron and scaling combinations IMO. For example I have two of the same video I was testing it with - one a 480p version, and the second a 720p version. If I set NNEDI3 chroma upscaling to 63 neurons and expand the video to full screen (1920x1080) it runs fine with no dropped frames, but if keep the settings the same and play the 720p version at full screen (again 1920x1080) it drops frames like crazy. I would think it would be more work for it to upscale the 480, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I don't suppose its a bug, is it? Anyone care to explain why upscaling from 480 to 1080p is easier for it to do than upscaling from 720p to 1080p?

I've come across two options to prevent dropped frames given the situation (since going in and changing the neurons every time I want to watch a 720p video is impractical).
One is to add 720p60 and 720p59 to devices (its the built in notebook screen, so 60hz and 59hz are the only settings it accepts) -> name of screen -> display modes -> list of all display modes madVR may switch to: area in madVR settings (in which case no up-scaling is done, but video playback quality isn't as good (more blurry looking) since its not the screens native resolution. The second is to turn neurons down to 32 from the 64 (and leave the 720p options off the switchable display mode settings) which also causes a drop in visual quality.

Which do you think is the better way to run?
Leave NNEDI3 neurons at 64, and allow screen sizing of 720p, or drop to 32 neurons and keep everything upscaling to 1080p?
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Old 4th April 2014, 20:42   #25658  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Anime Viewer View Post
Anyone care to explain why upscaling from 480 to 1080p is easier for it to do than upscaling from 720p to 1080p?
Scaling performance depends on the number of pixels to process, not strictly on the scaling factor.
More input pixels takes more time - similar, more output pixels would take more time (ie. higher target resolution), but if the target resolution is the same, smaller source video is just faster, because it has less input to process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anime Viewer View Post
Which do you think is the better way to run?
Leave NNEDI3 neurons at 64, and allow screen sizing of 720p, or drop to 32 neurons and keep everything upscaling to 1080p?
Don't change the resolution, your TV/Screen will then do the scaling and it'll be terrible.

Instead, setup profiles!
Setup one profile with 64 neurons for SD content, and a second profile for 32 neurons for 720p content. Problem solved!
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Old 4th April 2014, 21:16   #25659  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
Instead, setup profiles!
Setup one profile with 64 neurons for SD content, and a second profile for 32 neurons for 720p content. Problem solved!
Based on your suggestion I did the following (tell me if this sounds like the wrong way to do it):

I right clicked on scaling algorithms, and clicked the create profile group button (and checked the box for chroma upscaling).
(A new folder appeared which I named "upscaling per content")
In that new folder there were two folders (named Profile 1 and Profile 2), I renamed the top to "480p" and inside that I set chromas upscaling to NNEDI3 and 64 neurons. I clicked on the button that says edit shortcut and pressed "4". I renamed the bottom Profile to "720p" and inside that I set chromas upscaling to NNEDI3 and 32 neurons. I clicked on the button that says edit shortcut and pressed "7".
Now I need to remember to press 4 when viewing 480p content and 7 when viewing 720p content...
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Old 4th April 2014, 21:25   #25660  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Anime Viewer View Post
Which do you think is the better way to run?
Leave NNEDI3 neurons at 64, and allow screen sizing of 720p, or drop to 32 neurons and keep everything upscaling to 1080p?
For 720p content and your 1080p output size, NNEDI3 with 32 neurons is more than enough. I even lower that to 16 if I want to use smooth motion for 720p content to still have some breathing room. I would go as far to say that 64 is already overkill in your specific case.

Use a good quality dithering and NNEDI3 chroma upscaling and doubling. The higher neuron counts may give you benefits in still pictures, but if you don't zoom or your source isn't of very low resolution, just be sure to use NNEDI3 for both and don't focus that much on just the neurons.

I personally would trade neurons for more features active at any time.
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