x265 HEVC Encoder

[-QfG-]

dv profile 7 is Dual Layer. I need Profile 8.1 Single Layer DV + HDR Support. The newest makeMKV can create this Video Stream from a DV Dual Layer UHD, so i have one Single DV + HDR Videostream.
I search a Tool, that can convert 2 Streams (Video Layer and Dolby Vision Layer) in a Single Layer DV Profile 8.1.

[jlpsvk]

Originally Posted by -QfG-

dv profile 7 is Dual Layer. I need Profile 8.1 Single Layer DV + HDR Support. The newest makeMKV can create this Video Stream from a DV Dual Layer UHD, so i have one Single DV + HDR Videostream.
I search a Tool, that can convert 2 Streams (Video Layer and Dolby Vision Layer) in a Single Layer DV Profile 8.1.

you want this...

https://www.makemkv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=18602&p=96282#p96282

[agressiv]

Originally Posted by -QfG-

dv profile 7 is Dual Layer. I need Profile 8.1 Single Layer DV + HDR Support. The newest makeMKV can create this Video Stream from a DV Dual Layer UHD, so i have one Single DV + HDR Videostream.
I search a Tool, that can convert 2 Streams (Video Layer and Dolby Vision Layer) in a Single Layer DV Profile 8.1.

MakeMKV is doing their own thing by adding the Profile 7 EL on top of a the BL in a "piggyback" fashion, but this is now "officially" supported in Matroska. MKVToolnix is currently unaware of Dolby Vision, but the latest MediaInfo will see it.

If you truly want Profile 8.1, you'll need the RPU extracted as an elementary stream and can use x265.exe to encode it with this guide:

http://x265.org/x265-delivers-dolby-vision-streams/

The MakeMKV guide linked above is good if you just want to remux, but depending on your player - TV's tend to like dual-layer DV and players like NVidia Shield want single layer DV.

Muxing the video - well, let's just say that Dolby's mp4muxer doesn't like to mux encoded x265 Dolby Vision Profile 8.1 streams - it tends to just hang. I would advise using TSMuxeR until MKVToolnix has native support, assuming they handle other DV profiles when support is added. If you can get mp4muxer to work on encoded DV content, I'm all ears on how you got it to work.

[jlpsvk]

Originally Posted by agressiv

MakeMKV is doing their own thing by adding the Profile 7 EL on top of a the BL in a "piggyback" fashion, but this is now "officially" supported in Matroska. MKVToolnix is currently unaware of Dolby Vision, but the latest MediaInfo will see it.

If you truly want Profile 8.1, you'll need the RPU extracted as an elementary stream and can use x265.exe to encode it with this guide:

http://x265.org/x265-delivers-dolby-vision-streams/

The MakeMKV guide linked above is good if you just want to remux, but depending on your player - TV's tend to like dual-layer DV and players like NVidia Shield want single layer DV.

Muxing the video - well, let's just say that Dolby's mp4muxer doesn't like to mux encoded x265 Dolby Vision Profile 8.1 streams - it tends to just hang. I would advise using TSMuxeR until MKVToolnix has native support, assuming they handle other DV profiles when support is added. If you can get mp4muxer to work on encoded DV content, I'm all ears on how you got it to work.

MKVtoolnix 51 is aware of DoVi and preserves metadata...

With the guide o posted, you can encode pure HDR without cropping, the use encoded hevc to combine with EL+RPU to combine into PROFILE 8.1

[LigH]

New upload: x265 3.4+27-g5163c32d7

CLI changes since x265 3.4+14-gd419c7152:

• Defaults changed from undef to unknown for:
  --overscan
  --colorprim
  --colormatrix
• New options:
  

     --min-vbv-fullness <double>   Minimum VBV fullness percentage to be maintained. Default 50.00
     --max-vbv-fullness <double>   Maximum VBV fullness percentage to be maintained. Default 80.00
  
     --[no-]vbv-live-multi-pass    Enable realtime VBV in rate control 2 pass.Default disabled

Apparently there is a new commit based on an older branch (+27) which only updates the documentation but skips the latest additions with the "ABR Ladder" (+30)...

[ghostshadow]

hello, on version 3.0 you have introduced the parameters:
–dolby-vision-profile <integer|float>
and
–dolby-vision-rpu’ File containing Dolby Vision RPU metadata.
Excluding as for:
--dhdr10-info
You do not provide anything to exploit them. Indeed how to extract the Dolby Vision RPU? So these parameters are not usable.
For HDR10 + (--dhdr10-info) a coder had to face a python script to extract the metadata to use the: --dhdr10-info.
So what do we do to exploit the: –dolby-vision-rpu
thank

[LigH]

New upload: x265 3.4+30-g6722fce1f

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by ghostshadow

hello, on version 3.0 you have introduced the parameters:
–dolby-vision-profile <integer|float>
and
–dolby-vision-rpu’ File containing Dolby Vision RPU metadata.
Excluding as for:
--dhdr10-info
You do not provide anything to exploit them. Indeed how to extract the Dolby Vision RPU? So these parameters are not usable.
For HDR10 + (--dhdr10-info) a coder had to face a python script to extract the metadata to use the: --dhdr10-info.
So what do we do to exploit the: –dolby-vision-rpu
thank

Normally one uses software that generates the RPU file, like Dolby's SDK or ColorFront Transkoder. Unless Profile 8.x is targeted, that's coupled with software that creates the non-backwards compatible base layer, and the RPU data is relative to that.

Dolby hasn't really invested in making Dolby Vision a hobbyist-friendly format. Although the support in the iPhone 12 Pro might change that some. But even that uses a new profile that's not widely supported by TVs (HLG + metadata), and doesn't have RPU data compatible with typical DoVi content. Making a DoVi Blu-ray from an iPhone DoVi file requires changing every pixel in the video and generating new dynamic metadata.

[Blue_MiSfit]

Yeah, how would one even do that? Convert the HLG into PQ and do a new analysis pass in Resolve or something, then encode UHD BD compliant Profile 5 or 7 from that?

[FranceBB]

Originally Posted by benwaggoner

Dolby hasn't really invested in making Dolby Vision a hobbyist-friendly format. Although the support in the iPhone 12 Pro might change that some. But even that uses a new profile that's not widely supported by TVs (HLG + metadata), and doesn't have RPU data compatible with typical DoVi content. Making a DoVi Blu-ray from an iPhone DoVi file requires changing every pixel in the video and generating new dynamic metadata.

Our of curiosity, how are the new iPhones recording?
I saw the "Dolby Vision" announcement days ago, but it was rather vague. Is it H.265 10bit UHD HDR HLG 60p with metadata? Does it have the FULL HD 10bit additional layer with info to make the 12bit final result? Or perhaps it's still one layer in 8bit? And most importantly, given that most mobile phones have a ridiculously tiny sensor whose stops are low, does all this even make sense? I mean, I read that it can achieve up to 12 stops, but I think that it's not gonna get even close. SDR in BT709 100 nits is 6 stops, if they manage to get 9 stops out of that it would already be a miracle...

[Stacey Spears]

Originally Posted by Blue_MiSfit

Yeah, how would one even do that? Convert the HLG into PQ and do a new analysis pass in Resolve or something, then encode UHD BD compliant Profile 5 or 7 from that?

UHD BD only supports Profile 7.

[Stacey Spears]

Originally Posted by FranceBB

Our of curiosity, how are the new iPhones recording?
I saw the "Dolby Vision" announcement days ago, but it was rather vague. Is it H.265 10bit UHD HDR HLG 60p with metadata? Does it have the FULL HD 10bit additional layer with info to make the 12bit final result? Or perhaps it's still one layer in 8bit? And most importantly, given that most mobile phones have a ridiculously tiny sensor whose stops are low, does all this even make sense? I mean, I read that it can achieve up to 12 stops, but I think that it's not gonna get even close. SDR in BT709 100 nits is 6 stops, if they manage to get 9 stops out of that it would already be a miracle...

They use Profile 8.3, which is HLG + Dolby's dynamic metadata. If you have an LG C9 or CX, it will play in Dolby Vision. If you have an older LG, then it plays as HLG.

Profile 5 and 8 are single layer 10-bit profiles. Profile 7 has the additional full enhancement layer for addition bit-depth. Profile 5 uses ICtCp while Profile 7 and 8 use YCbCr.

The reason the iPhone went with Profile 8.3 was so they would not have to tone map for the SDR version.

[nakTT]

Originally Posted by LigH

New upload: x265 3.4+30-g6722fce1f

Thanks for the upload.

[Blue_MiSfit]

Originally Posted by Stacey Spears

The reason the iPhone went with Profile 8.3 was so they would not have to tone map for the SDR version.

That makes sense, but FWIU HLG is only actually "backwards compatible" in terms of dynamic range, not color gamut (since rec2020 / p3d65 / WCG -> rec709 is hard to do well automatically).

So, from a backwards compatibility standpoint, you can either use WCG (and thus only be really backwards compatible with SDR WCG displays of which there aren't too many AFAIK) or use standard 709 gamut and thus be only HDR and not WCG which won't take advantage of modern HDR displays that are all WCG.

Do I have that wrong?

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by Blue_MiSfit

That makes sense, but FWIU HLG is only actually "backwards compatible" in terms of dynamic range, not color gamut (since rec2020 / p3d65 / WCG -> rec709 is hard to do well automatically).

So, from a backwards compatibility standpoint, you can either use WCG (and thus only be really backwards compatible with SDR WCG displays of which there aren't too many AFAIK) or use standard 709 gamut and thus be only HDR and not WCG which won't take advantage of modern HDR displays that are all WCG.

Do I have that wrong?

That was certainly how HLG was originally intended to work by the BBC. But the de facto HLG has drifted somewhat; after all, essentially no devices shipped with Rec 2020 and NOT PQ. It must be using 709 primaries or else it wouldn't be backwards compatible.

My take on HLG has been "it may work in practice, but it definitely doesn't work in theory!"

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by Blue_MiSfit

Yeah, how would one even do that? Convert the HLG into PQ and do a new analysis pass in Resolve or something, then encode UHD BD compliant Profile 5 or 7 from that?

Yes, pretty much. Of course, while in Resolve, additional color work could be done to get to >1000 nits, use more saturated colors, etcetera.

Profile 8.3 isn't great, but it makes for a substantially better HDR source than anything 709 would be. The 12 Pro Max with its improved optics will probably lead to some interesting student and experimental HDR (and HFR) titles. Biggest question is how clean the HEVC encoding will be. I need to finally order mine.

[FranceBB]

Originally Posted by benwaggoner

That was certainly how HLG was originally intended to work by the BBC. But the de facto HLG has drifted somewhat; after all, essentially no devices shipped with Rec 2020 and NOT PQ. It must be using 709 primaries or else it wouldn't be backwards compatible.

Wait, so you're saying that it's using Rec709 primaries with an HLG color curve applied? That would be a pretty poor choice...
Also, if it's not and they're just displaying BT2020 on non BT2020 compatible displays that's a poor choice as well...

My take on HLG has been "it may work in practice, but it definitely doesn't work in theory!"

lol
My take is: most users are too "inexpert" to notice...
(and with the term "inexpert" I've been very kind)

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by FranceBB

Wait, so you're saying that it's using Rec709 primaries with an HLG color curve applied? That would be a pretty poor choice...
Also, if it's not and they're just displaying BT2020 on non BT2020 compatible displays that's a poor choice as well...

HLG's whole premise is the same set of code values will encode two different creative intents on two very different EOTFs, without metadata. So it's fundamentally pretty nuts. I don't know that they're using 709, but I can't imagine what else it would be. Viewing 2020 as 709 looks weird and brown.

My take is: most users are too "inexpert" to notice...
(and with the term "inexpert" I've been very kind)

HLG is mainly being boosted for live broadcast scenarios, where there aren't colorists anyway. Premium content (movies and scripted TV) creatives and technologists aren't fans.

[FranceBB]

Originally Posted by benwaggoner

I don't know that they're using 709, but I can't imagine what else it would be. Viewing 2020 as 709 looks weird and brown.

I guess we're gonna have to wait 'till someone will upload a sample, then...

[benwaggoner]

Originally Posted by FranceBB

I guess we're gonna have to wait 'till someone will upload a sample, then...

Yeah, I need to actually go and buy mine!