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Old 23rd September 2015, 20:20   #33121  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CiNcH View Post
madVR_framequeue already locks up. To be sure i tried again original 0.88.17 and it also locked up this time. So it must be between 88.16 and 88.17.
Ouch. That's the worst case scenario. Those changes in 88.17 to render in paused and stopped mode, and for low latency OSD really do bite me in the a... Unfortunately they're very important for some media players, so I can't really remove them. Will have to invest some work to create test builds between 88.16 and 88.17, but not today, anymore.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 20:39   #33122  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Is it recreated when you delete it and run madVR afterwards?
Yes it is recreated.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 21:25   #33123  |  Link
madshi
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Originally Posted by XRyche View Post
Yes it is recreated.
Ok, please use this debug build to create a new debug log and upload it for me:

http://madshi.net/madVRXRyche1.rar

This build will not do anything differently, just the debug log will give me some more information.

Just to double check: When disabling NNEDI3 everywhere (both chroma upscaling and image doubling) all problems are gone, right?
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Old 23rd September 2015, 21:27   #33124  |  Link
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just asking XRyche did you changed the folder for madVR yet? to something like c:/madvr ?

the Program Files on windows 10 takes security way to serious...
i guess worth a try.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 21:57   #33125  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Ok, please use this debug build to create a new debug log and upload it for me:

http://madshi.net/madVRXRyche1.rar

This build will not do anything differently, just the debug log will give me some more information.

Just to double check: When disabling NNEDI3 everywhere (both chroma upscaling and image doubling) all problems are gone, right?
No if I use any type of image doubling (NNEDI3,NEDI,Super-xbr) I get the massive frame-skipping before an image actually appears. NNEDI3 in image doubling looks like an brownish embossed effect and NNEDI3 for chroma upsampling produces a green image regardless of whether it is used in conjunction with frame doubling or not.

I will run your special build after I try huhn's suggestion because Windows 10 is seriously paranoid with it's security (although they have no problem with keeping track of you if they(Microsoft) are doing the tracking.).

Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
just asking XRyche did you changed the folder for madVR yet? to something like c:/madvr ?

the Program Files on windows 10 takes security way to serious...
i guess worth a try.
As I told madshi I'll try it. I'm willing to try anything at this point.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 22:22   #33126  |  Link
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madshi, here's the log for the custom debug build: https://www.mediafire.com/?hujbvatwmw0rj6k . It's even compressed :P . I did notice that there was a slight pause (3 seconds at most) when I started the file which starts in windowed mode when I initially played the file. When I played it again in debug mode there was no pause until I went to FSE mode than there was the typical 350 fps skip.

huhn, unfortunately moving the madVR folder to even an entirely different drive didn't make a difference. I made sure I uninstalled and deleted the madshi entry in the registry before I installed madVR from it's new location.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 22:34   #33127  |  Link
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Originally Posted by XRyche View Post
huhn, unfortunately moving the madVR folder to even an entirely different drive didn't make a difference. I made sure I uninstalled and deleted the madshi entry in the registry before I installed madVR from it's new location.
was very unlikely anyway.
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Old 23rd September 2015, 23:02   #33128  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post

Then it's probably either a GPU driver bug, or a GPU hardware issue. Maybe using a different GPU driver version helps?
I updated my graphics drivers to the latest version using DDU. Didn't help. Tried re-installing MadVR but also this didn't help.
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Old 24th September 2015, 00:09   #33129  |  Link
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Let me start off with some history. First, for the longest time the best performing AMD driver has been 13.12. Second, I have never been able to use D3D11 in any form, it worked, but as soon as I would pause PotPlayer, it would flash and queues would fall to zero and never recover, oddly it would not report dropped frames, but the video would stutter like mad because of the empty queues. So I have been stuck on a very old driver (if I wanted to push NNEDI3 to the max) and stuck with D3D9 (not that it really mattered when it comes to quality). I continued doing updates to both driver and madVR and always ended up rolling back features/driver.

Now along comes this spectacular version of madVR! First I just updated madVR and ran it as is. WOW! GPU usage dropped from 93% to 66% HUGE improvement. So I bumped up one of the three NNEDI3 settings from 32 neurons to 64 (yes I do chroma and I do both in luma) and this pushed the GPU up to 78% (couldn't get any more neurons even though there is still room). Nice little bonus, more neurons is always better. So I figured with this headroom I should be able to run the latest AMD drivers without having to dial back my neuron counts. And sure enough it worked... GPU usage did go up as expected (78% up to 85%) so 13.12 is still the best performing AMD driver when it come to madVR. However, the magic you did madshi, does allow users like me to upgrade driver without worrying about reducing settings in madVR. HUGE kudos for that! Also, D3D11 now also works flawlessly with PotPlayer, yet another nice little bonus.

I just wanted to say a big Thank You!

As for the missing screen config option when using a digital flat panel. I could see there being a use to including it. As I mentioned above, I have an old Plasma with rectangular pixels (1024x768). I tested out the screen config (set it to projector to expose the settings) and setting the anamorphic lens to 4/3 did work flawlessly to compensate for these rectangular pixels. I personally don't need this, since I know how to set PotPlayer's Output Device to "TV-Out 16:9" to fix any mis-matched aspect ratios. But maybe others don't know this or their player won't allow this. It could be useful, but of course the choice is yours

Anyway huge Kudos to making madVR more efficient!

QB

EDIT: Should have mentioned this is all on Windows 8.1 x64
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Old 24th September 2015, 00:25   #33130  |  Link
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WOW! GPU usage dropped from 93% to 66% HUGE improvement.
on W7 or W8?
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Old 24th September 2015, 01:20   #33131  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Not sure what to say about that. Don't really have enough information. Could you try creating two debug logs: One which has the faster render times, and one which has the slower render times? For the slower render times it would be great if it would be right from the start, that would make it easier for me to interpret the logs.
http://filehorst.de/d/bAHCafIb

steps to reproduce from madVR default settings:
disable fullscreen exclusive mode.
enable nnedi3 64 neurons for luma.
play a 720p source in fullscreen on a 1080p screen.
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Old 24th September 2015, 02:25   #33132  |  Link
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Ok, here are some logs that might help.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0ud1gfzukm...0logs.zip?dl=0
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Old 24th September 2015, 04:38   #33133  |  Link
QBhd
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Originally Posted by leeperry View Post
on W7 or W8?
Sorry, guess I should have mentioned that... Windows 8.1 x64

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Old 24th September 2015, 07:09   #33134  |  Link
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What is the quality difference between applying SuperRes before/after image upscaling? Is this difference only visible when upscaling 2x or more?
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Old 24th September 2015, 08:02   #33135  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QBhd View Post
Let me start off with some history. First, for the longest time the best performing AMD driver has been 13.12. Second, I have never been able to use D3D11 in any form, it worked, but as soon as I would pause PotPlayer, it would flash and queues would fall to zero and never recover, oddly it would not report dropped frames, but the video would stutter like mad because of the empty queues.
Wow... I'd had the same flashing as you had since the implementation of D3D11. I will try the new build today. I hope it works. Windows 10 x64 here.
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Old 24th September 2015, 09:45   #33136  |  Link
FreeFall
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madshi,

Yeah, you told me not to use stretch to window, I'll try to explain things a bit better. Tested using Windows 7 64bit Pro and Mpc-hc 1.7.9 (x64).

Using the keep black bars visible if they contain subtitles option and setting it to forever doesn't work for me, the video is still being cropped (osd shows 720*450). Changing it to 90min or any other setting lower works without any problems, using the DVD sample I uploaded and a handful of disc's and videos I have.

The reason I use stretch to window on that Blu-ray sample is because in full screen mode touch window from the inside does not remove the pillar boxing, using stretch to window does which is exactly what I want.

These are the settings I use:

automatically detect hard coded black bars.
notify media player about black bars, no more than once every 2 sec.
crop black bars.

What I was asking for is the ability to simply crop the black bars without doing anything else, no aspect ratio correction. The same as using Avisynth to crop before re-encoding or on the fly via FFDshow. As I said before it's not a big deal but would come in handy for people like me who don't mind breaking the AR and stretching the image a little.

The advantage this method has is that you can remove the black bars and keep the subtitles intact, here is an example using the DVD sample.

madVR, touch window from inside:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q4ixihzrfj...0crop.jpg?dl=0

re-encode cropped to 720*450, stretch to window:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ypia193l5b...0crop.jpg?dl=0


Thanks.
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Old 24th September 2015, 10:35   #33137  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chros
3. 1 more thing popped in my mind about cropped black bars and profiling by size : will this work/detect screen changes on the fly?
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Yes, it should.
1. Indeed, indeed That's truly amazing!!!

2. About my NNEDI3 chroma upsampling crash: I just refreshed to newest vga drivers, doing a clean install (see my signature):
- the crash is still there
- Windowed Overlay mode still isn't available with this combination

Thanks for your awesome work!!!!
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Old 24th September 2015, 11:13   #33138  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XRyche View Post
No if I use any type of image doubling (NNEDI3,NEDI,Super-xbr) I get the massive frame-skipping before an image actually appears.
That is very weird because the original log you uploaded clearly shows that there's a 14 second delay caused by compiling the OpenCL kernel. The compiling of the OpenCL kernel should not be done if you use other chroma upscaling and image doubling algorithms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by XRyche View Post
madshi, here's the log for the custom debug build: https://www.mediafire.com/?hujbvatwmw0rj6k . It's even compressed :P . I did notice that there was a slight pause (3 seconds at most) when I started the file which starts in windowed mode when I initially played the file. When I played it again in debug mode there was no pause until I went to FSE mode than there was the typical 350 fps skip.
It gets weirder and weirder. OpenCL compiling is done at startup, not when entering FSE mode. So OpenCL compiling doesn't explain delays when entering FSE mode.

Unfortunately the new log isn't helpful (thanks for compressing it though). The log still seems to be from the old build. I think what happened is that you probably copied the new build into the madVR folder, and then did the manual file rename thing afterwards. By doing that you practically disabled the new build again, because you renamed it to "madVR [release].ax" and the media player only ever uses "madVR.ax". Please copy the special XRyche build into the madVR folder and afterwards do *not* rename the files. The new build is a debug build. Maybe I should have named it "madVR [debug].ax" to avoid confusion, but I did say that it was a debug build.

I will need 3 logs from you now. Sorry about the extra work, but your problem descriptions are very confusing to me (see above). So I need those 3 logs to understand what's really going on:

1) Same as before. Just start playback with NNEDI3 enabled. Wait for the video to appear. Then stop.
2) Start in windowed mode, so the delay does *not* occur, let it play for about 10 seconds. Then switch to FSE mode, so the delay occurs. Wait for the video to appear. Then stop.
3) Disable NNEDI3 everywhere (all chroma upscaling, luma doubling, chroma doubling, luma quadrupling and chroma quadrupling). Start playback, reproduce the long delay, wait for the video to appear. Then stop.

Please create 3 separate logs for these 3 situations. After every situation simply rename the log file with a suitable name to explain what the log contains. Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingfire View Post
I updated my graphics drivers to the latest version using DDU. Didn't help. Tried re-installing MadVR but also this didn't help.
Did NNEDI3 ever work for you? This looks like either a GPU driver bug or a hardware problem to me. I'm sorry, I don't think there's anything I can do here... You could try reporting this to your GPU's support forums.

Quote:
Originally Posted by QBhd View Post
Now along comes this spectacular version of madVR! First I just updated madVR and ran it as is. WOW! GPU usage dropped from 93% to 66% HUGE improvement. So I bumped up one of the three NNEDI3 settings from 32 neurons to 64 (yes I do chroma and I do both in luma) and this pushed the GPU up to 78% (couldn't get any more neurons even though there is still room). Nice little bonus, more neurons is always better. So I figured with this headroom I should be able to run the latest AMD drivers without having to dial back my neuron counts. And sure enough it worked... GPU usage did go up as expected (78% up to 85%) so 13.12 is still the best performing AMD driver when it come to madVR. However, the magic you did madshi, does allow users like me to upgrade driver without worrying about reducing settings in madVR. HUGE kudos for that! Also, D3D11 now also works flawlessly with PotPlayer, yet another nice little bonus.
Great to hear! D3D11 now working, is that due to the new madVR build? Or due to the AMD driver update? Or was both needed to make that work? Just for my interest, in case you know...

Quote:
Originally Posted by huhn View Post
http://filehorst.de/d/bAHCafIb

steps to reproduce from madVR default settings:
disable fullscreen exclusive mode.
enable nnedi3 64 neurons for luma.
play a 720p source in fullscreen on a 1080p screen.
Hmmmm... I can see that in the "good" log NNEDI3 processing takes about 15ms per frame. The other render steps for each video frame are all < 3ms each. In the "bad" log it's exactly the same way - until smooth motion FRC kicks in. Then suddenly NNEDI3 processing takes 25ms per frame, and the last processing step takes 10ms. I'm not sure why it's sometimes this way and sometimes the other way. It's simply the GPU which seems to take more time doing the rendering. Can't see anything in the logs which would point to madVR doing anything differently. It *could* be somewhat related to smooth motion FRC, but I'm not sure about that. Smooth motion itself doesn't seem to need a lot of time in either case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hprd View Post
Ok, here are some logs that might help.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0ud1gfzukm...0logs.zip?dl=0
What problem are the logs for? What exactly did you capture there? I need to know what to look for, otherwise it's just millions of characters in a text file, and I wouldn't know what to do with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dansrfe View Post
What is the quality difference between applying SuperRes before/after image upscaling? Is this difference only visible when upscaling 2x or more?
Huh? SuperRes is always *after* upscaling. Not sure what you mean?

Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeFall View Post
Yeah, you told me not to use stretch to window, I'll try to explain things a bit better. Tested using Windows 7 64bit Pro and Mpc-hc 1.7.9 (x64).

Using the keep black bars visible if they contain subtitles option and setting it to forever doesn't work for me, the video is still being cropped (osd shows 720*450). Changing it to 90min or any other setting lower works without any problems, using the DVD sample I uploaded and a handful of disc's and videos I have.

The reason I use stretch to window on that Blu-ray sample is because in full screen mode touch window from the inside does not remove the pillar boxing, using stretch to window does which is exactly what I want.

These are the settings I use:

automatically detect hard coded black bars.
notify media player about black bars, no more than once every 2 sec.
crop black bars.

What I was asking for is the ability to simply crop the black bars without doing anything else, no aspect ratio correction. The same as using Avisynth to crop before re-encoding or on the fly via FFDshow. As I said before it's not a big deal but would come in handy for people like me who don't mind breaking the AR and stretching the image a little.

The advantage this method has is that you can remove the black bars and keep the subtitles intact, here is an example using the DVD sample.

madVR, touch window from inside:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q4ixihzrfj...0crop.jpg?dl=0

re-encode cropped to 720*450, stretch to window:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ypia193l5b...0crop.jpg?dl=0
Hmmm... Now I'm a bit confused. I had originally thought that those subtitles were burned into the video image. But after checking again that's not actually the case. It seems the DVD Navigator outputs a subtitle stream and "somebody" draws them to the image. I'm not even sure who does that exactly.

Does anybody know which software (internal subtitle renderer, external subtitle renderer, LAV Video Renderer, whatever) draws subtitles output by the DVD Navigator onto the video image - and at what time (before madVR gets the images or after or something)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chros View Post
2. About my NNEDI3 chroma upsampling crash: I just refreshed to newest vga drivers, doing a clean install (see my signature):
- the crash is still there
- Windowed Overlay mode still isn't available with this combination
Looked at your log. The crash should be solved in the next build, in any case. However, it seems you're using the old exclusive mode path (meaning: "present several frames in advance" unchecked). Is that correct? Doing so means that madVR cannot share the render device, which also means the new D3D11 OpenCL interop cannot be used, nor Windowed Overlay. You'll have to activate "present several frames in advance" in the FSE settings, to make the new NNEDI3 work, and Windowed Overlay.
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Old 24th September 2015, 11:48   #33139  |  Link
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i have a sample problem i lose my calibrate for my monitor after use dx11
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Old 24th September 2015, 12:01   #33140  |  Link
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Is the window touching text in the OSD only supposed to update when the window is changed like it does ATM?
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