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Old 23rd September 2020, 14:10   #1  |  Link
orion44
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DVD creator software with a built-in high-quality subtitle generator?

Which DVD creator software would you recommend that can generate high-quality DVD subtitles from text subtitles (SRT, ASS)?
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Old 23rd September 2020, 19:33   #2  |  Link
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I don't know any.
All those I know make use of extra modules (like Lemony) to create the subtitles.

After a long search (like 10 years), what I use for DVD is also what I use for BD, namely EasySup (I think), the companion of MultiAVCHD. It can use fonts, styles (bold, italic), unicode (good if you're not English), and the subs are perfectly rendered. It needs however the extra step of converting the subs to DVD format (it outputs BD format, incompatible; a small price to pay for a great tool and quality). Until this, I used MaestroSBT, which gave only a couple of bad rendered subs per total. At the other end of the spectrum is SubtitleWorkshop that rendered only a couple of sub correctly (but can work directly on the DVD). Also good to use, when no styles are needed (or all subs look the same) are the txt2sub series (Txt2Sup converts with one click an srt/sub(microdvd) subtitle at a sup file. The sup files can be used with ifoedit in order to add extra subtitles in a dvd by using the method of reauthor. srt2sup, sub2sup, srttosup, subtosup, srt to sup, sub to sup.).
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Old 24th September 2020, 06:23   #3  |  Link
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I really like the quality of subtitles that MaestroSBT generates.

Is there a way to create VobSub subtitles with MaestroSBT?
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Old 24th September 2020, 12:26   #4  |  Link
Emulgator
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Freeware:
.ass -> MaestroSBT-ANSI 2.6.2.1 or MaestroSBT-Unicode 2.6.2.1 -> .sst -> Muxman -> Rip into Vobsub using SubtitleEdit 3.5.16

There are .sst handedits necessary to go from SBT -> .sst -> Muxman.
If needed I can write a MaestroSBT -> Muxman How-To with preferred parameters.

Rendering a 1- to 4-line Verdana 18pt
with Antialiasing + Outline looked very good to me recently.
Played from 23.976 DVD -> Toshiba VHS/DVD/HDD -> Composite -> Sony FHD,
and from 23.976 DVD-> Oppo 205 -> HDMI -> Loewe FHD.
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Last edited by Emulgator; 24th September 2020 at 13:08.
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Old 24th September 2020, 12:52   #5  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emulgator View Post
If needed I can write a MaestroSBT->Muxman How-To with preferred parameters,
since there are .sst handedits necessary to go from SBT -> .sst -> Muxman.
That would be extremely helpful.
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Old 25th September 2020, 05:54   #6  |  Link
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Looking back to my own thread, I noted that I mentioned there a software that also outputs perfect subtitles - AviAddxSub - in form of IDX/SUB (vobsub).

This is what happens with "bad" subtitles on selected hardware. The subtitles wobble, up and down. The software I mention, do NOT have this issue. I repeat, it took me a very long time to find a subtitler that honours italics, bolds, unicodes and output perfect subs, most of them only checked 2 from that list.
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Old 25th September 2020, 15:20   #7  |  Link
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++++++++++++++++ Subpic Preparation Aegisub -> MaestroSBT -> Muxman ++++++++++++++++++

Why I have chosen Aegisub32 2.1.8 ?.
Old and safe, works in WinXP32 and Win7U64. I had no luck with later Aegisub versions.
Standalone, no installation needed.
With video and audio preview from DVD .m2v + .ac3 elementary files.
Prerequisites: ffmpeg, .d2v and AviSynth 2.60. Avisynth+ 32 or +64 won't work.

After editing you got to adjust the style for later rendering.
MaestroSBT will read, interpret and respect these values.

Font: For DVD I recommend the rather wide Verdana 18pt, especially for 16:9 projects.
In 16:9 the original font will be rendered condensed into the subpic, only to be extended again on display!
Normal or condensed fonts suffer greatly here.
Even with 1 pix outline and antialiasing Verdana is proven to not stick together too much.

For nice display within Aegisub you may want o choose a bottom margin of 30, but !
Later in MaestroSBT: Font sizes given from script style are interpreted arbitrary,
not mapped to pixels (says MaestroSBT Manual...)

So before final export for MaestroSBT for 2,35:1 on 16:9 you may want to choose a .ssa/.ass bottom margin of 10..12 !
This fits 2 subtitle lines into 2.35:1 lower black bar, at 3 lines the upper line will be in the active picture,
the border exactly in between lines 1 and 2

---- Subpic rendering in MaestroSBT 2.6.2.1 (ANSI or Unicode Version, you decide) --------

MaestroSBT reads/writes no .ini nor registry key, so always comes up with its defaults.

Start with MaestroSBT -> File -> Open.
(The ANSI Version will refuse to open UTF-8, although the UTF-8 choice is not greyed out.)
Navigate to your subtitle script file.

MaestroSBT by default assumes only extension .ssa.
If you want to navigate to .ass or other script
you have to enable that (or all) extension(s) by choosing appropriate dropdown.

MaestroSBT by default wants to generate subpics in the folder where the script resides.
If you want to choose a different output folder before rendering -> Press "Set files".

MaestroSBT by default wants to generate DVDMaestro .son subpics as Compressed TIFF,
but we want to use Muxman

Press "Rendering" and choose Script dropdown .sst (Scenarist)
Bitmaps: Windows BMP 4bits.
Choose your anamorphic correction (None for square pixels, 4:3, 16:9 as appropriate)

Choose "Only one set of text, antialias and outline colors"
MaestroSBT will render
background to pixeltype b
font body to pixeltype p
Outline following .ass script (my .ass preference: 1 pixel) to pixeltype e1
Antialiasing to pixeltype e2.

2-colour: MaestroSBT will render
background to pixeltype b
font body to pixeltype p
Outline following .ass script (my .ass preference: 1 pixel) to pixeltype e1
Shadow following .ass script (my .ass preference: 1 pixel to the right) to pixeltype e2

(Subpic Pixeltype Values for reference:
background b 00
pattern p 01
emphasis1 e1 10
emphasis2 e2 11 )

(For reference: MaestroSBT Antialiasing is (was?) based on a Windows Graphic engine.
Windows 95 would need Plus! Pack or font smoothing pack,
from Windows 98 it was part of the OS, now it is BTNexGenIPL32.dll)

Now still in "Rendering Options" -> Press "Color Keys"

(MaestroSBT by Startup Default maps as follows:
b - Background - Blue
p - Pattern - Red
e1- Antialias - White
e2- Outline/Shadow - Black)

(MaestroSBT after Press "Default" maps as follows:
b - Background - White
p - Pattern - Blue
e1- Antialias - Red
e2- Outline/Shadow - Black)

Since we intend to mux with Muxman we have to set Mapping manually:
b - Background - White
p - Pattern - Black
e1- Antialias - Red
e2- Outline/Shadow - Blue
(This mapping is applicable for Scenarist, DVDMaestro, DLP, Muxman)

(DLP Note: DLP will apply its hardwired colors and transparencies !
b - Background - White (c=1, t=0)
p - Pattern - Black (c=6, t=15)
e1- Antialias - Red (c=7, t=7)
e2- Outline/Shadow - Blue (c=7, t=15)
If you want to change that after muxing, use DVDSubEdit.)

Press "Timing":

Example: MaestroSBT timing for 23.976 into Muxman:
In: 23.976
Out: 23.976

-> You can not change 23.976 to DROP in MaestroSBT GUI,
(MaestroSBT GUI forces 29.97 if you do so)
but you can still handedit the .sst from NON_DROP to DROP before importing into Muxman.

(For reference: MaestroSBT recalculates from .ass as follows:
Input timing in hh:mm:ss.cc
-> calculating frames in 64bit precision
-> apply SMPTE Offset hh:mm:ss:ff
-> apply Tools: "Snap to frames", "Adjacent Subs gap 1 Frame"
-> calculating Output timing SMPTE hh:mm:ss:ff in 64bit precision)

Press "Edit & Preview", the preview window pops up.
Now you can check the correct timing, rendering placement, the correct character set.
If you can provide your video as Uncompressed (YV12 worked), MPEG-1 .mpg or DV-AVI
(or whatever DirectShow can provide) you can even watch your subpicture placement on that video.
.m2v elementary didn't work.Mpeg-2 program Stream might be working.

Then press "Generate".

Maestro SBT 2.6.2.1 will render the correct coloured subpics into the chosen folder,
but the resulting .sst script will still come up with some fixed and non-fitting values, see below.
--------
Muxman will read, interpret and mux from that .sst script:
TV System NTSC or PAL
NTSC timing in NDF or DF -> TAPE NON_DROP or DROP)
Subpic Transparencies (these are in reality opacities) or "Contrast"
Pixel type Mapping
Color Palette numbers
so after .sst export from SBT and before .sst import into Muxman handediting of the following lines is needed.
Keep the reversed sequence in mind (E2 E1 PA BG) !

----------- MaestroSBT exports fixed and wrong associations ----------
Contrast (0 15 15 15)

p white
e1 blue
e2 black
b red

PA (255 255 255 - - - )
E1 (255 0 0 - - - )
E2 (0 0 0 - - - )
BG (255 0 0 - - - )

SP_NUMBER START END FILE_NAME

Color (3 2 1 1)

----- now we handedit (E2 E1 PA BG) -------------------
#(if needed: TAPE from NON_DROP to DROP)
#Contrast looked best to me if not maxed to 15, so 14 and antialiasing colour 1 tick above the mid, so 8.

Contrast (14 8 14 0)

# The following outcommented entries we leave alone
# Palette entries:
#
# 01 : RGB(255,255,128)
# 02 : RGB( 0, 0, 0)
#

PA (0 0 0 - - - )
E1 (255 0 0 - - - )
E2 (0 0 255 - - - )
BG (255 255 255 - - - )


SP_NUMBER START END FILE_NAME

Color (3 7 7 4)

- end of handedit -----------

--- Muxman Standard palette ---
Blue Red Black White
Green Pink Yellow Petrol
DGrey LGrey Brown Moss
NBlue Magenta Orange Violet

Applied to muxman's standard palette the handedit would give
yellow font body with yellow antialiasing and black outline

outline c=3 black t=14
antialiasing c=7 (yellow) t=8
body c=7 (yellow) t=14
background c=4 (blue) t=0

##############################################################################
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Last edited by Emulgator; 25th September 2020 at 16:33.
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Old 25th September 2020, 15:21   #8  |  Link
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Muxman 1.4.4 HowTo
Why muxman ? It works on WinXP32SP3 and Win7U64SP1,
standalone, no installation needed.
Muxman output is never flagged as faulty by PGCEdit.
You got plenty of submuxing, even Karaoke style.
Who is able to use muxman CLI has a freeware DVD muxer.
But you need to know DVD structure quite well, because with muxman you are in the driver seat.
No templates for now.

GUI:
To start a new .mxp project: File -> New Project
To load a previous .mxp project: File -> Load Project
The .mxp file format is human-readable and easily editable.

Muxman .mxp project file structure:
You get some .mxp example files with muxman, you may open them in any editor and edit them for practising.
There are .mxp v1, v2, v3.
Necessary to know the structure if you want to run the commandline version.
Not yet documented by me, but can be deducted from existing projects.

Creating a new project:

Video Import
Segment contents -> Video -> Add
Multi-file manager pops up.
Accepts .m2v Video and/or bmp files.
Arrange video/image files, give them preferences and set durations

Audio Import
Segment contents -> Audio -> Add
Multi-file manager pops up.
Accepts 0 to 8 Audio streams (.ac3, .dts, .mpa, or .lpcm)
Arrange the audio files using the multi-file manager.
Set the language, extension, and delay for each audio track.

Subpicture Import:
Segment contents -> SubPictures -> Add
Multi-file manager pops up.
Accepts 0 to 32 subpicture streams (sup, sst, or vob).

Muxman happily accepts .sst from Maestro SBT with 4-bit .bmps.
Muxman will read, interpret and mux from such .sst script:
TV System (NTSC or PAL)
NTSC timing in NDF or DF -> (TAPE NON_DROP or DROP)
Subpic Transparencies (these are in reality opacities) or "Contrast"
Pixel type Mapping following Conversion Rules see below
Color Palette numbers 1 to 16

After import in Muxman you can arrange subpicture files
Set the language and extension for each sub stream.
If video is 16:9 assign each sub stream to a display mode,
For 16:9 video you will need to prepare and render up to 3 subpic streams per language
(Condensed for 16:9 Wide, Normal for PS, LB

Chapter Import: File -> Import Chapter
Accepts ANSI .txt file with frame numbers.
For 23.976 projects you have to convert 23.976 fps frame numbers
into the pulldowned 29.97fps frame numbers before importing.

Closed captioning import (not yet documented by me)
I guess CC has to be brought in already muxed into video stream as Private Stream.

----------------
Notes:
All video files must match in resolution, aspect ratio, coding type (mpeg-1 or mpeg-2).
The first file accepted sets the project values.
Image files (bmp) must be 720x480 or 720x576 and get encoded as mpeg-2.
Selecting to browse the video file will open the multi-file manager window.

All audio files in one track must match in coding method and channels.
Selecting to browse an audio file track will open the multi-file manager window.
Selecting a sub file again will replace that file with the new selection.

Default DVD navigation:
first play -> vts1 title 1
title menu -> vts1 title 1
vts1 root menu -> title 1
---------

Muxman Timeline
NTSC Timecode is in NTSC SMPTE NDF 29.97fps (also 23.976 projects).
PAL Timecode is in PAL SMPTE.
Upper Fader Bar is time navigation.
Lower Fader Bar is Zoombar, fader right gives total view, fader left gives maximum enlargement down to single frame.
Ignore timecode on Lower Fader Bar.
Any item on any track can be doubleclicked and properties edited.

Subpic Tracks: After import the grey waveform-like things become double-arrows if you zoom in.
Timeline -> Doubleclick on individual double-arrow to get a preview compositor video window with rendered subpic.
All parameters for that individual subpic become available,
via Controls you can even animate that subpic in Karaoke Style with 9 wipe patterns.
Below Subpics BOVs can be added. Rightclick on that track.
One click on Highlight bar and you get a preview window. Navigate I-framewise using < and > buttons.

Controls -> Adjust Subpics: Reimports and overwrites your last operation

My Muxman Safety Tip:
If streams got to be changed I would call it good practise to delete them first,
then save the project and close Muxman.
Reopen, load previous project and add stream new.
On Win7U64 it seemed to me that some old parts might still reside in RAM.
I found good renderings at wrong times, and a few aborts.
Memory leaks ? After a new Muxman start all came out perfectly.

Before Muxing
Choose your output folder unless you want the default of D:\VIDEO_TS
Segment contents -> Output folder -> browse

Then click on "start". A progress bar will pop up.
After successful muxing you find your VIDEO_TS folder at the desired location.
Logfile will be at C:\muxman.log
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Last edited by Emulgator; 25th September 2020 at 16:05.
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Old 25th September 2020, 16:17   #9  |  Link
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Thank you for these detailed instructions!
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Old 26th September 2020, 07:56   #10  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orion44 View Post
Is there a way to create VobSub subtitles with MaestroSBT?
Essentially, one can convert one subtitle format into another. Via a long working path, with lot of dangers lurking from each software (the danger to repeat all this in case of an error in one piece of the chain), one can output good quality SUB (DVD) then re-rip them into IDX/SUB (VobSub). I think these have some reasons to exist only on computers, and by now all player can use SRT directly. I would not undergo this burden.

Have you tried the software I hinted you at? Yes, the name is misleading, for its main purpose was indeed to subtitle AVIs, yet it can output IDX/SUB directly. It observes the bold, italic (it also does not crop the margins of italics - not sure if you saw this, the rightmost long letter, like l, I, t, T or ! gets clipped for falling outside the base line - I circumvent this error on other software by placing a blank space after italics ), the subtitles are rendered and flagged correctly. It can even slightly decrease the font size if the line is too long (but also can nastily cut the line into 2, if way too long, be careful) In one go you have them.
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Old 26th September 2020, 10:52   #11  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghitulescu View Post
Have you tried the software I hinted you at?
I tried AVIAddXSub, and the subtitle quality is just ok.

But I decided to use MaestroSBT and Muxman using Emulgator's instructions because I really like the look of generated subtitles.

They look almost the same as the ones on professional hollywood DVD movies.

I think MaestroSBT has the best rendering engine.

Last edited by orion44; 26th September 2020 at 11:01.
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