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7th May 2019, 12:35 | #56162 | Link | ||
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In a typical (for madVR users at least) DS chain we have panel properties in maVR ("the display expects the following RGB output levels"), RGB output levels in LAV Video, GPU setting (for Nvidia "Adjust video color settings/Advanced/Dynamic Range) and, lastly the TV setting. So far I've always understood that the best way to go was to have Full throughout the chain. The Kodi wiki confirms that you get correct range reproduction but states that this introduces an extra scaling process and makes calibration more difficult (as BTB and WTW are clipped). Is this true? Kodi wiki suggests that using Limited (Kodi), Full (GPU), Limited (TV) avoids this scaling, at the cost of having the desktop overly dark. This would translate to Limited, Limited (madVR, LAV), Full (GPU), Limited (TV), I guess. Would this bring improved quality for video playback? Quote:
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7th May 2019, 13:09 | #56164 | Link | |
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Black and white clipping patterns can still be calibrated quite easily without BtB and WtW. The majority of PC users should be doing things this way. If you read the first section of the madVR guide in my signature, this is explained in some detail.
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HOW TO - Set up madVR for Kodi DSPlayer & External Media Players |
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7th May 2019, 14:43 | #56165 | Link | |
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Doing this (basically 1D LUT) stuff by eye is ol'Skool, you can get the edge patches right , but without alot of training you can't get the middle patches to balance..
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7th May 2019, 15:55 | #56166 | Link |
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Sometimes it looks unnatural when people are moving, but it seems some are pissed off according to their post. So this is my last post about it for now.
I indeed see if something is natural 60p or something is not and blended together. 24p content should look like it looks, don’t use smooth motion. So much pain about perfect color and many use stock 60 Hz for everything, if they like it, silly me I don‘t like it. The thing I am trying to show if you have a screen with max 60 Hz and use smooth motion for all you won‘t get perfect results for all source files, but if you switch to the matching refresh rate you will get perfect smooth playback, at least as much the soutce file can give you of it. Download big buck bunny rendered at 60.000 hz and show me how I get this smoothness out of 50p played back at 60 Hz screen. But 50p at 50 hz looks great. For higher refresh rate I don‘t have the equipment which supports 3840x2160p120 or more. |
7th May 2019, 18:41 | #56167 | Link | |
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Matching refresh rates it optimal, of course. You argue that smooth motion is not smooth, which I disagree with, but 50p into 60 Hz uses too many blended frames. As huhn said, we want double the refresh rate or higher for smooth motion.
We do not recommend smooth motion for displaying 50 fps at 60 Hz. Quote:
Edit: Blue Planet II deinterlaced by LAV video to 50p and displayed at 60 Hz with smooth motion looks smooth to me.
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madVR options explained Last edited by Asmodian; 7th May 2019 at 18:48. |
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7th May 2019, 18:47 | #56168 | Link | |
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7th May 2019, 18:52 | #56169 | Link |
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It should show that 50p is not suitable for smooth motion on 60 Hz screen. And of course that 50 fps is not worse in terms of smoothness just because there are 10 fps less. Beginners could think that. The refresh rate of the screen matters.
I personally don‘t have anything against users who want to use smooth motion, they just have also to know it downsides and limitations. Matching refresh rates are worth a try especially if I look at people discussing details to death but watching a 24p movie on 60Hz mode without smooth motion. Motion „resolution“ is probably a point missing in some playing setups of some users, not hard to set it up. Huge difference. |
7th May 2019, 18:57 | #56170 | Link | ||
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Yes, matching refresh rates can be worth it. You do not need to say smooth motion is not smooth to say this, you can stick to explaining the real limitations of smooth motion.
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madVR options explained Last edited by Asmodian; 7th May 2019 at 19:01. |
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7th May 2019, 19:24 | #56171 | Link |
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50i/p with smooth motion @60hz doesnt work "perfect" for all kind of sources (i.e. live sport @50hz). Its still way better for "60hz only PC monitors" than without smoothmotion, but I prefer a matching refresh rate too if possible.
For 23/24p sources (film content) @60hz with smooth motion works very well for me. |
7th May 2019, 19:27 | #56172 | Link |
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I fully agree. But there was, probably still is a feature in madvr to add other refresh rates for 60hz only monitors. I don‘t need it now so I am not sure.
Last edited by Klaus1189; 7th May 2019 at 19:29. |
7th May 2019, 21:06 | #56174 | Link |
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Yes, just google intel 24p bug, there were 23.976 files played at 24.000 so every 42 secs a repeated frame was shown. You need two different refresh rates for these two similar but different framerates.
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7th May 2019, 21:36 | #56176 | Link |
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That is not wrong if your TV is set to limited as well. Everything but madVR will be wrong but madVR will be correct.
This is actually the optimal configuration if your display needs limited range for some reason. It also matches the old standards all this stuff was based on so you still have the WtW and BtB information at the display, but given the calibration should clip it anyway this isn't actually beneficial. Edit: WtW and BtB does make manual calibration easier, so it can be a benefit that way.
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madVR options explained Last edited by Asmodian; 7th May 2019 at 22:58. |
8th May 2019, 08:37 | #56177 | Link | |
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Quote:
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.p...16#post1271416
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8th May 2019, 12:48 | #56178 | Link |
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QuestioN I was playing Aquaman 4k HDR. And i pressed CTRL+J for the OSD.
And it said 1506 nits.. I have madvr@using pixel shaders target peaks 1000 nits. Do I need to set it to 1506 or higher nits since that is being reported in Madvr OSD? Also, do you recommend the option "present a frame for every Vsync" in madvr to be checked or not? And lastly how can you know for sure if Vsync is being used in kodi dsplayer/madvr etc? I had created a profile for kodi and MPC HC/BE with adaptive performance and Vsync On. But i just want to check wether it is really on. And Vsync does that mean a performance hit? Or generally really advised to use? Also on the RGB vs YCBCR debate https://www.avsforum.com/forum/465-h...-10-bpc-2.html This guy says: "YCbCr 422 10 bit/12 bit is the best you can go for HDR video sources at the moment I'm afraid." Rather then RGB 12 bcp FULL range @23 hz..? Still not sure what is best. Someone on reddit nvidia"For movies you want 420, 12bit(they are all made in 420), for non HDR games rgb full, for HDR games 420 12bit or 422 10bit. 444 is for monitors/primary displays." Is what I found on this reddit from an user. Is this true though? What settings is best for HDR Movies, which best for SDR movies and which best for SDR games and HDR games? Option 1: 4K@60Hz 4:2:2 YCBR 12bpc Limited Range Option 2: 4K@60Hz 4:4:4 YCBR 8bcp Limited Range Option 3: 4K@60Hz 4:4:4 RGB 8bpc Full range Option 4: 4k@23Hz 4:4:4 RGB 12bcp Full range Option 1 probably best for HDR gaming according to reddit user Option 2 probably best for SDR movie playback according to reddit user Option 3 probably best for SDR gaming according to reddit user Option 4 probably is best for HDR movie playback then according to this topic? Yet AVSforum seems to claim otherwise. Jesus what a mess is this... One setting for each end use? Could someone clarify the situation? Last edited by chrisssj2; 8th May 2019 at 13:18. |
8th May 2019, 13:46 | #56179 | Link | |||||
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so no. Quote:
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yes Vsync should be who even gave you the idea that this may not be the case? Quote:
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and this is the case with games too as long as the game is still rendered in 10 bit that's different from madVR where rendering in 8 bit is not rarely superior to 10 bit. i don't care about some random reddit user that make a list same for AVS. |
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Tags |
direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling |
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